Monday, August 10, 2009

Reality Check Needed: But Not by Americans

This should make everyone rest easier, feel better and all of you can stop reading the health care bill, because The White House is on the job!

The White House launched an online web-site, called "Reality Check" to “debunk” charges of rationing, forced euthanasia, hurting small businesses and harming veterans and seniors.

Yep, you read that right.

The White House, the very place where President Obama resides; who approves of this monstrous bill; which practically takes a legal degree to interpret, has created their very own site to refute myths about the very bill HE wanted passed lickety-split!

Let me ask this. If you are already a little pessimistic about the government and are questioning the health care bill, why in the heck would you go to a web-site that is created and run by the very people who wrote the bill that you are skeptical about in the first place?


Do these people possess an ounce of common sense?

229 comments:

  1. I find this comical myself. Common sense...not so much!!

    I guess that this website tells the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth, so help me God. Oops, forgot where I was for a second. I guess that is what you get for listening to lawyers or at least one particular one!!

    This site is supposed to make everything just peachy? I don't think so. Maybe they should have thought about all this chaos before they tried to shove a confusing, unbelievably long, bill through Congress. Then again, there hope was probably that we would all just go along with it because Obama said it was good.

    ReplyDelete
  2. The Obama campaign had to operate a website caled Fight The Smears, to refute the lies told about Obama and his policy positions. As one of the few that calls for and tries to enforce civility Pamela, it would seem logical that you would be saddened and outraged that Obama has to operate another website to refute lies.



    I've stated plenty of times my opposition to this bill on the basis it's more of a pander to lobbyists and special interests. I'd much rather the President I voted for go down fighting for real reform and insurance that covers everyone and a real funding mechanism. Not the usual BS of "cost cutting" or "bringing efficiencies." We all know that's crap but because we love to hear it instead of the truth that things cost money, too many people hide behind that nonsense.


    Pamela and Jennifer had some good ideas they shared at my site. But they still required the government to implement them. How do we "reform" without government help?

    I'm going to bed soon and if you're a right leaner and don't want to vist TSR, say so in your comment here. I'll paste Pamela's and Jennifer's comments here as soon as I can.

    ReplyDelete
  3. That is if Pamela and Jennifer okay that. I don't want to take any liberties here.

    ReplyDelete
  4. Jennifer: Yes, the government telling us the whole truth about the bill THEY wrote. That's what I found so ironic about it. Like a person disputing it would go THERE for answers! And if it had been written in plain English there would be no need for a web-site, lawyers or any misinterpretation in the first place.

    ReplyDelete
  5. Truth: No, I never said we couldn’t condemn our politicians. Their children are off limits, yes, but not the politicians themselves. They need to be called on the carpet when they are wrong.

    The Obama Administration wouldn’t have to operate a web-site if this bill was written clearly. And of course they are pandering, why do you think it doesn’t include tort-reform? What occupation do most of our congressmen and women have a degree for? Try LAW. Are they trying to protect their offspring who may be lawyers, too, and tort reform would hurt those careers? Just something to think about.

    You have my permission to copy my comment here.

    ReplyDelete
  6. This comment has been removed by the author.

    ReplyDelete
  7. Truth, by all means post away.

    I'm actually not against government involvement. I think that there is no way to get out of this without government help and I have no problem with that.

    I'm not sure if I can speak for others but I would be fine if government cracked down on tort reform. I have no problem with government coming up with a program to help those that genuinely can't afford it. I think it could help especially at a state level. In fact NJ has a plan where kids can get low cost or free health care. I hope government steps in to control the profit of health care insurance companies. I just don't want a total recall. To use a quote by Ablur......"Burning down the whole house to solve a bug problem isn't the answer. "

    Truth, you have a very caring heart! You've opened your mind to different ideas that will all get us to the same place with the same results.

    One of my biggest problems with this bill is the way it was written. It was worded to confuse and that is exactly what it has accomplished. He should have no need of a website to explain things. It should have been worded better the first time!

    ReplyDelete
  8. I'll never go there, I'd be afraid my name would end up on the list of people who dare to ask questions.

    ReplyDelete
  9. My oh my, Is there anything that you do like about him? lol I don't like his having pizza flown in from Chicago at our expense. I was upset with the flyby over the Liberty Bell at our expense. I am upset with a Czar for every occasion at our expense. I don't particularly like the date night because of the expense and so many family members vacationing in Paris at our expense. We are in a terrible state of economic crisis in America and I truly believe he should be a lot more frugal. I don't like him blocking all of his records from being shown and I truly believe that someone who goes to the lengths he has gone to to keep things private must surely have something very damaging to hide.

    ReplyDelete
  10. At the health-care town hall meeting Monday night. Outspoken opponents of the Democratic overhaul plan, which Cardin supports, vented their hostility at the first-term senator. In an echo of similar events around the country, most of those in the capacity crowd at Towson University were clearly hostile to the reform.
    Yes, the American sleeping Giant has awakened, and he ain't happy. All those puny "community oranizer/activist" clowns were completely drowned out..

    ReplyDelete
  11. "Let me ask this. If you are already a little pessimistic about the government and are questioning the health care bill, why in the heck would you go to a web-site that is created and run by the very people who wrote the bill that you are skeptical about in the first place?"

    I'm having a great time reading "My Life in France" by Julia Child.

    She and her two fellow chefs wrote the classic "Mastering the Art of French Cooking."

    Let's pretend it's 1962 and a group of people have started a cooking club and are discussing how best to make the classic sauce buerre blanc. One member says she read in Ms. Child's book that it's okay to substitute oleo for the buerre, another says she read that it was okay to use a can of Campbell's cream of mushroom soup. These two start arguing over who's correct.

    What would you advise these two women to do to verify or debunk their claims?

    I'd suggest that they go to the source of the information on how to make a perfect buerre blanc. They may even telephone the author to get it straight from the professional's mouth (I once did this when I called the author of a cookbook who lived in Cambridge, Mass., and found what I thought was an error in the ingredient list--turns out I was right, and the author promised to correct the error in the next printing of the book.)

    But to get back to your question on why anyone should "trust" what the government verifies or debunks in this health care bill. My answer would be--who else would you ask? The bill came out of Congress, didn't it?

    Of course, you could read the entire bill yourself. rockync over at The Swash Zone is actually doing this.

    But if one is too cynical to believe that everything this government represents is evil and underhanded, then nothing, not even the health care bill's actual text will convince you.

    It's a good thing to have skepticism where government wherever is involved and to question and research this very complicated and controversial bill.

    Skepticism is good; cynicism is destructive.

    PS Re the recipe for buerre blanc: Dear Gawd! No oleo and NEVER, NEVER, NEVER cream of mushroom soup. Did I say never? NEVER!

    ReplyDelete
  12. Sorry but your "recipe" reeks from sour ingredients, like the rest of France.
    We do not need French "recipes" for our health care.

    Trading the best health care system on the planet for one like the French or a Third World country is crazy. Get the trial lawyers (John Edwards) types out of the picture and make a few changes to be more efficient and cost effective plan is the way to go... Socialism is a miserable failure around the world, and we don't need or want it..--let freedom ring.

    If you really want to read the entire bill (the REAL bill) yourself.
    I'll do my best to post the highlights in a few minutes.

    ReplyDelete
  13. Highlights of Proposed Health Care by Obama and his supporters!• Page 58: Every person will be issued a National ID Healthcare.• Page 59: The federal government will have direct, real-time access to all individual bank accounts for electronic funds transfer.• Page 65: Taxpayers will subsidize all union retiree and community organizer health plans (read: SEIU, UAW and ACORN)• Page 72: All private healthcare plans must conform to government rules to participate in a Healthcare Exchange.• Page 84: All=2 0private hea lthcare plans must participate in the Healthcare Exchange (i.e., total government control of private plans)• Page 91: Government mandates linguistic infrastructure for services; translation: illegal aliens• Page 95: The Government will pay ACORN and Americorps to sign up individuals for Government-run Health Care plan.• Page 102: Those eligible for Medicaid will be automatically enrolled: you have no choice in the matter.• Page 124: No company can sue the government for price-fixing. No "judicial review" is permitted against the government monopoly. Put simply, private insurers will be crushed.• Page 127: The AMA sold doctors out: the government will set wages.• Page 145: An employer MUST auto-enroll employees into the government-run public plan. No alternative s.• Page 126: Employers MUST pay healthcare bills for part-time employees AND their families.• Page 149: Any employer with a payroll of $400K or more, who does not offer the public option, pays an 8% tax on payroll• Page 150: Any employer with a payroll of $250K-400K or more, who does not offer the public option, pays a 2 to 6% tax on payroll• Page 167: Any individual who doesnt' have acceptable healthcare (according to the government) will be taxed 2.5% of income.• Page 170: Any NON-RESIDENT alien is exempt from individual taxes (Americans will pay for them).• Page 195: Officers and employees of Government Healthcare 20 Bureaucracy will have access to ALL American financial and personal records.• Page 203: "The tax imposed under this section shall not be treated as tax." Yes, it really says that..

    To be continued

    ReplyDelete
  14. Page 239: Bill will reduce physician services for Medicaid. Seniors and the poor most affected."• Page 241: Doctors: no matter what speciality you have, you'll all be paid the same (thanks, AMA!)• Page 253: Government sets value of doctors' time, their professional judgment, etc.• Page 265: Government mandates and controls productivity for private healthcare industries.• Page 268: Government regulates rental and purchase of power-driven wheelchairs.• Page 272: Cancer patients: welcome to the wonderful world of rationing!• Page 280: Hospitals will b e penalized for what the government deems preventable re-admissions.• Page 298: Doctors: if you treat a patient during an initial admission that results in a readmission, you will be penalized by the government.• Page 317: Doctors: you are now prohibited for owning and investing in healthcare companies!• Page 318: Prohibition on hospital expansion. Hospitals cannot expand without government approval.• Page 321: Hospital expansion hinges on "community" input: in other words, yet another payoff for ACORN.• Page 335: Government mandates establishment of outcome-based measures: i.e., rationing.• Page 341: Government has authority to dis qualify Medica re Advantage Plans, HMOs, etc.• Page 354: Government will restrict enrollment of SPECIAL NEEDS individuals.• Page 379: More bureaucracy: Telehealth Advisory Committee (healthcare by phone).• Page 425: More bureaucracy: Advance Care Planning Consult: Senior Citizens, assisted suicide, euthanasia?• Page 425: Government will instruct and consult regarding living wills, durable powers of attorney, etc. Mandatory. Appears to lock in estate taxes ahead of time.• Page 425: Goverment provides approved list of end-of-life resources, guiding you in death.• Page 427: Government mandates program that orders end-of-life treatment; government dictates how your life ends.• Page 429: Advance Care Planning Consult will be used to dictate treatment as patient's healt h deteriorates. This can include an ORDER for end-of-life plans. An ORDER from the GOVERNMENT.• Page 430: Government will decide what level of treatments you may have at end-of-life.• Page 469: Community-based Home Medical Services: more payoffs for ACORN.• Page 472: Payments to Community-based organizations: more payoffs for ACORN.• Page 489: Government will cover marriage and family therapy. Government intervenes in your marriage.• Page 494: Government will cover mental health services: defining, creating and rationing those services...


    This past election has been the worst thing to happen to America in my lifetime. The anger, animosity and in-fighting are unbelievable! Between the out of control government spending, the inevitable across the board tax increases, STILL no job growth and now the threat of losing health care…This country is spinning out of control fast and I don’t see anyone doing anything to put on the brakes. The top 5% of the country is already paying 60% of federal income taxes and 40% don’t pay any federal income taxes? Who do you think is going to fund the destruction of our health care system? Take a look at your neighbor, take a look at your kids, take a look at your co-workers, friends, and folks you go to church with. The only coffers left for the government to steal from belong to the middle class.

    ReplyDelete
  15. Sgt.York,

    You have deliberately misread my entire comment.


    BTW. The "best health care" on the planet? Then why does Cuba have a higher life expectancy rate, better infant mortality rate, and better mortality rate for children under 5 years of age than we do?

    Should the country that has the best health care in the world be number one in those categories?

    We're not.

    That, sir, belies your claims.

    ReplyDelete
  16. Shaw Kenawe said..."Then why does Cuba have a higher life expectancy rate, better infant mortality rate, and better mortality rate for children under 5 years of age than we do?"

    Well them perhaps Ms. Kenawe, you should catch the next banana boat down there.

    One of the biggest scams America has ever put over on the people was the election of Barack Obama. People are indeed looking to government for solutions, but now that Obama fever is wearing off, some realism is taking root. It is crystal clear that government has a lot of power to reward those who generate wealth and to punish them. However people may joke about a boss being like a diaper, ( always on your *** and full of ***) they realize that if the boss goes out of business, paying for diapers gets a whole lot harder. Sensible people let class envy last about as long as a beer buzz. Then they get back down to work. Others are still hanging out on the street corner waiting for their handout!

    ReplyDelete
  17. Guila: I’m not liking the 44 Czars, either. They aren’t vetted; appointed by Obama; answer to Obama and can’t be subpoenaed; but are paid with our tax dollars. Our Congress goes through a vetting process and we’ve had them give themselves raises in the dark of night and pass bills without reading them, among other things we don’t approve of. I can’t even imagine what these Czars will do when they won’t have to answer to us or anyone in Congress…only Obama. Only time will tell if these Czars are a good idea or a very bad one.

    Sergeant: I understand the anger and frustration of the American people. And I’m glad that more and more citizens are finally getting involved in the affairs of our country. However, yelling and screaming isn’t the answer. It doesn’t solve anything. BUT, our representatives, Obama included, are obligated to answer the questions WE have and they need to do it BEFORE this bill is passed. Health Care Reform is necessary, I’ve said that all along, I just don’t like this bill. But maybe with the people getting involved and our reps finally realizing we are interested, we will get reform that all of us can agree on.

    Shaw: I know cooking is one of your hobbies and I’d love to be a taste-tester when you are dabbling in some of those fancy recipes!

    I understand what you’re saying about consulting a connoisseur when you have questions. However, I don’t consider the government an expert when it comes to health care. And even though they wrote the bill that doesn’t mean they read it. Remember the stimulus and the debacle with the AIG bonuses. Dodd wrote them but couldn’t remember what he wrote.

    To answer your question, yes, read the bill, which I am doing. I know Rocky is doing the same and I will go to her site for an analysis, too, because she is very familiar with health care;as she is in the field. And yes, go to Congress for answers. Our Representatives should read the bill and should be able to answer our questions.

    I just found it amusing that this web-site is from The White House and is using videos of people stating everything is a-okay. What else are they going to say? No, we’re lying through our teeth? I truly don’t believe that the government is “evil” but I do think if they could have more access into our personal lives, they would and I believed this under Bush, too. I am “skeptical” of our government, always have been and probably always will be.

    Sergeant: I don’t think Shaw was trying to say we need France’s health care. Far from it. But just this morning I was having a conversation with my husband asking him why America is the ONLY country that doesn’t cover all of its legal citizens. I’m not talking socialism. But just out of curiosity, why are we the only country that doesn’t have a plan that covers people who aren’t covered under Medicare, Medicaid or private insurance? Just so you know, I think if the 18-34 yr old invincibles can afford insurance they should purchase it. So, I’m talking about a plan for the people who aren’t old enough for Medicare and aren’t poor enough for Medicaid but truly can’t afford insurance. Just something to think about.

    I know what you mean about taxes. The middle class is going to get hit. I can’t see any other way, either. And if that happens, it’s going to take the middle class and put them to lower middle class and the lower middle class will then drop to poor. At least that’s what I’ve been thinking. But what else can happen? Someone has to pay for the health care and it just can’t be the “rich.” Plus our overwhelming deficit, that has to get paid down and there’s only a few ways that can happen. Cut spending; raise taxes; raise interest rates and higher inflation, all which will hurt the middle class. We are in a real conundrum.

    This is a time when all of us need to join together as True Americans and stop the infighting amongst ourselves.

    ReplyDelete
  18. With all due respect to you and your blog Pamela.
    I just came back from reading Shaw Kenawe's blog and did all I could do to prevent myself form almost vomiting.
    So the ranting I have done as you called it, in my view was highly justified.
    However I will respect your fine blog and not be as strong opinioned as I have been.
    Thank you in advance for your understanding.

    ReplyDelete
  19. Sergeant: If you got the impression that I said you were ranting, I am very sorry. I accept ALL views and opinions on my blog and respect everyone. You may feel free to disagree with me or anyone else, just please do it respectfully. That’s all I request.

    ReplyDelete
  20. Dear Sergeant York,

    You did not answer my question on why this country, with what you claim is the best health care system in the world, isn't doing better in infant mortality, life expectancy, and mortality for children under 5 years old. Why does Cuba do better?

    Your response that I should take a boat to Cuba is perhaps evidence that you cannot back up your statement that we are the best, and so your only way to cover this undounded claim is to ignore my challenge.

    That may fool some people, but not everyone.

    You made a claim, I refuted it, and you make a wise crack. That weakens your argument and actually, negates your point.

    Pamela,

    I agree. This health care bill is a behemouth and needs to be looked at very carefully. You and rockync are brave.

    ReplyDelete
  21. Of course I know, I understand, you liberals know it all. I'm just a stupid racist conservative, who just don't understand what His Holiness Obama wants to do for me.
    Sorry I even got started with you. I prefer being able to make my own decisions without your help.. I don't pretend to know it all as you seen to. But I DO know that this health care bill is NOT good for me, or my family or for America.....Thank you.

    ReplyDelete
  22. Pamela D. Hart said...

    Sergeant: If you got the impression that I said you were ranting, I am very sorry. I accept ALL views and opinions on my blog and respect everyone. You may feel free to disagree with me or anyone else, just please do it respectfully. That’s all I request


    And I will honor your request. I didn't think that I was being disrespectful.

    ReplyDelete
  23. Sergeant: You weren’t being disrespectful. Since you are new, I took the liberty of explaining my rules. My bad.

    ReplyDelete
  24. Sgt.York,first let me thank you for your service. I've seen your blog and I think that you have done a wonderful job serving America and for that I am deeply grateful.
    That being said, I think it's impossible to change the mind of a liberal (any liberal). I've tried it before, and believe me, it doesn't work. They try to discredit everything you throw at them. If they can't they just spin everything or they change to another subject. And then the "how about Nixon" thing... They don't like it when you tell them something that goes against everything they stand for (in fact, they might get so angry they remove your comment from their blog.... Delete, delete, delete! They resort to lies and and attacks The only people who can really be shown that liberalism is a disease are people who are on the fence, people who haven't really made up their mind yet. True liberals won't ever change and will praise Obama 'till the day they die. But, silly people who actually thought Obama was who he said he was and who are now experiencing buyer's remorse can change. Indeed. The Left elected an idiot. Let's just hope that they see the light before it's too late.

    ReplyDelete
  25. I'm amazed and gratified by people who post here, who do the great work of exposing the contents for those of us who can't or don't. Thank you, thank you! Especially for the page by page notes of what's inside.

    Remember, folks, as Obama preaches about cutting costs, he brazenly boasted that our energy bills would "necessarily skyrocket"??? He really does not care whether our costs go up or down, just as long as he gets to control EVERYTHING.
    I just watch that STACKED audience Town Hall meeting and I had to turn it off as it was only a platform for Obama to give his BS speech.
    The people of America want their country back. They see it slipping away. Fear of the government taking over their lives is forcing people.
    It's time for the Republican Party to take the elephant by the tusks and give us a choice. It's time to stop trying to keep up with the Democrats by acting just like them and get back to their conservative values and ethics.
    The days of liberal RINOs and wishy-washy Repub-moderates are numbered if they don't wise up. And if they give in to the liberals; they always do, their days are numbered.. It has to stop now or they will pay the price at the polls.

    ReplyDelete
  26. Sergeant York the Anti Obama Czar said...
    Of course I know, I understand, you liberals know it all.


    Dear Sgt. York the Anti Obama,

    That is your characterization, not mine. I've have never thought nor said I "know it all." You made that observation based on your irritation with my answer to you, not based on any factual evidence.

    Sgt. York wrote "I'm just a stupid racist conservative, who just don't understand what His Holiness Obama wants to do for me."

    Sgt. York, I have not called you or anyone here a "stupid racist." It is really discouraging to read this level of discourse. I've written nothing even remotely approaching that.

    Again, I believe you're irritated with me because I challenged you about US health care being the best in the world. Instead of coming back with your own argument as to why you think I'm wrong, you suggested I take the next boat to Cuba.


    SGT. YORK wrote: "Sorry I even got started with you. I prefer being able to make my own decisions without your help.. I don't pretend to know it all as you seen to."

    Sgt. York, please review any of my statements to you. You will see with your own eyes that I never offered to help you make any decision, nor did I "pretend to know it all" as you wrongly accuse me.

    This is the problem, my friends. I tried to politely engage Sgt. York, I presented a fact: that Cuba beats the USA in better infant mortality, children under 5 years old rates, and life expectency rates, and was prepared to back that statement up with links to those facts.

    This caused Sgt. York to get angry with me, and then accuse me of saying or implying things that I did not. The fact that I said something with which Sgt. York disagrees does not make me a know-it-all or a person who, he imagined, thinks he's a racist or stupid.

    The problem, is, Sgt. York, you couldn't refute what I wrote, so you decided to try to make me look rude and intolerant.

    My words are here for everyone to see. I did nothing of the sort.

    I just wish we could get beyond this senseless labeling when we come up against someone who has facts that dispute our dearly held, but incorrect information.

    ReplyDelete
  27. Shaw....the problem I have with statistics is that unless you are comparing two identical things, there are always variables involved.

    "The "best health care" on the planet? Then why does Cuba have a higher life expectancy rate, better infant mortality rate, and better mortality rate for children under 5 years of age than we do?"

    You mention infant mortality rate....there are many things that could affect this statistic. A mother's ability to get her hands on alcohol or drugs could greatly effect the infant mortality rate. So could the diet that she eats. Medicine she takes. Other countries might not have as much access to junk food, or medications that could harm the infants. It's not necessarily the care given that is lacking.

    You also mention higher life expectancy. Again, a persons diet, access to drugs or cigarettes, can alter when they die. Obesity, can also effect statistics.

    Unless you are comparing apples to apples, statistics can be very misleading.

    I honestly think our diet and medications available contribute to some of the lower statistics.

    What is it with these verification words.....phicuniv LOL

    ReplyDelete
  28. I just watched Obama's Town-Hall Meeting, and here is my review of it.
    Did you see that “SIDE SHOW” that Obama put on today? I did and if anyone thinks that “SHOW” wasn’t staged, you were born yesterday! That place was packed with his supporters.
    Obama will try to sell this plan to the American people and he will do whatever is necessary to do it. But I doubt if it’s going to fly. He packed this speech with “his SO CALLED facts” that will be repeated by his supporters followed by the old “Yes We Can” song. Obama will say “you wont have to wait in line for heath care, and in supports eyes it becomes a “fact.” If Obama says you can keep your current healthcare, in supports eyes it becomes a “fact.” If Obama promises better care at a lower cost, in supports eyes it becomes a “fact.” because after all Obama himself says so. But for the first time since he became Emperor, Obama is losing the PR/message war and its killing him and his supporters. 0bama has proven over and over that he is incapable of dealing with a hostile audience or even one determined and intelligent person who disagrees with him.
    I was only able to see the first two “so called” random people that asked questions. It was SO staged that I couldn’t take anymore.
    If you want to see what else I have to say about this Side Show. Please see my blog. I don’t want to make this comment any longer than this. Thank you Pam

    ReplyDelete
  29. Incredible. Of all the right leaning bloggers, only two, Pamela and Jennifer, offered any alternatives to the health insurance plan being bandied about. NONE of the others did. The only one that gave an honest answer among the rest of you was Right is Right when she said she didn't trust Obama and wouldn't support anything he did.


    I don't want to get Blogmaster Pmaela mad at me but this is why there is no progress on any of the big questions of the day. Unless it the situation is so biased to on side of an issue for political reasons (eg. The Iraq invasion) all there is is accusations and bullsh!t.


    The Dems offered a damn plan. I don't like it either. It sucks. It panders. It will benefit nobody that doesn't already benefit from the way health care is paid for now. But I see zero alternatives from the right. Just their panders to their constituents about less government and big brother. The truth is they don't want reform any more than the blue dogs that get big donations from insurance companies.

    It seems like a new guy each week decides to take on Shaw or me on something. They all try the same nonsense and either call us socialists or something else. But they never offer up any opinions that address the issues we're blogging about.


    Offer an alternative to what's on the board or come out and say you like it the way it is my right leaning friends. If you're here you most likely don't mind being involved. Don't be the useless clown nobody likes but tells us whatever we're doing won't work. Then when asked what will answers with "I don't know. I just know that won't."


    Make a difference.

    ReplyDelete
  30. Jennifer,

    I believe the stats compare how the heath care system in each country delivers the needed remedies to address the problems of any given population.

    If you think a better comparison would be between the US and another industrialized nation, then we can take a look at that and see that we are not doing well at all for a nation that thinks it has the best health care in the world. We do, I believe, have the best medical technology and science, we just don't deliver it to all of our citizens, just to those who can afford it, and to those who have jobs and are not out of work.

    That leaves almost 50 million Americans facing enormous difficulties that citizens in other developed nations don't have to face.

    For a country as great as this one, that just doesn't make sense.

    REPORT: US infant mortality highest of industrialized nations

    The nation's youngest and oldest citizens are suffering the most from a fragmented, wasteful and in some cases dangerous health care system, according to a new study. When compared to nearly two dozen other industrialized countries, the U.S. has the highest infant mortality rate and the lowest life expectancy for people who have reached the age of 60.

    This also addresses the subject.

    ReplyDelete
  31. Truth101 said: "It seems like a new guy each week decides to take on Shaw or me on something"

    Oh really, then I guess you and "Shaw" must be pretty controversial.

    But I'm sorry to sink your ego.
    I did not come here to take on either one of you.
    I simply posted a comment and "Shaw Kenawe" "took on" ME. So you see, it's not all about "you"
    Have a very pleasant day.

    ReplyDelete
  32. SGT. YORK QUOTED AND THEN WROTE THIS: Truth101 said: "It seems like a new guy each week decides to take on Shaw or me on something"

    Oh really, then I guess you and "Shaw" must be pretty controversial.

    But I'm sorry to sink your ego.
    I did not come here to take on either one of you.
    I simply posted a comment and "Shaw Kenawe" "took on" ME. So you see, it's not all about "you"
    Have a very pleasant day.


    Dear Sgt. York,

    I am tired of your mischaracterizing me all over this comment board.

    I answered a comment by Pamela D. Hart and gave the Julia Child recipe analogy and THEN YOU MADE THE "SOUR" REMARK ABOUT MY COMMENT.

    And now you incorrectly tell TRUTH 101that I took YOU on?

    The only ONLY reason I keep coming back here is because I have to constantly defend myself against people like you who, I won't use the word LIE, but I'll say people like you who misrepresent the truth and impugn me.

    I reserve the right to keep what people say about me in the realm of truth, not fiction.

    Most people won't bother to read back in the thread and will take your inaccuracies and misrepresentations of me as fact.

    I am replying to your comment to TRUTH 101 to set the record straight and verify for people here to see that YOU TOLD AN UNTRUTH.

    BTW, I never attacked you in any way, shape, or form. I was polite in my replies to you. And yet it was you who characterized my blog as vomitous.

    Sorry, Pam to get all heated here, but if we ever hope to dialog with each other, we need to, at the very least, be truthful about what we post in these comments.

    It's only decent.

    ReplyDelete
  33. Dear Shaw;
    I never said that you attacked me...never.

    I simply used Truth101's expression
    "It seems like a new guy each week decides to take on Shaw or me on something."
    ----------------------
    What I meant by that was..I did not answer your comment, but rather you answered mine.

    I really think that this has gotten out of hand and over blown.
    I had no idea who you or Truth were before today so why would I want to "attack" you?

    Anyway, like I said this has gotten over blown and I'm going to end it right here, I hope you do the same.

    ReplyDelete
  34. The proverbial pot calling the kettle black. Oh, the irony just gets more & more delicious!

    ReplyDelete
  35. And I am still waiting for alternative health insurance plans from all my right leaning friends except Pamela and Jennifer. At the very least could one of you show some get up and go and at least say "yeah. What those two said."

    ReplyDelete
  36. Here we go again, enter the flim flam president again peddling his no assurance-insurance. With credentials as bogus as a traveling snake oil salesman, he claims to have the miracle cure for the whole, entire healthcare system. Shills in the audience can attest to that. From town to town he travels, looking for the next sucker. The town meetings of Democrats are always scripted, with questions handed out to the *selected* few. Obama's thugs should not waste their time trying to convince people that this will be aboveboard. We have no reason to believe that this president will suddenly get honest. He doesn't even know the meaning of the word.
    When Obama was asked if he and his family would be participating in this plan, all he could say was this is not about me?????
    I heard what he said today and I don’t believe even one word of it.
    This bill is over 1000 pages long and I've only been able to read a very small part of it. And what I read, I didn’t like. It is very disturbing to see what is stated in this plan. There will be no choice as they state. The new name they want for this plan is public option rather than Government run Health care. There will be no option. It will be unlawful to switch your insurance once this bill is passed (if passed) to any other insurance other than the government run program. What happened to choice in America?

    ReplyDelete
  37. Hum, Shaw, There is an old saying... What comes around… Goes around.. And you don't like it when it comes around... do you!

    ReplyDelete
  38. And yet another all American Republican Girl shows her intellectual weakness by refusing to offer a plan of her own. Why am I not surprised.

    ReplyDelete
  39. Anonymous,

    Hiding behind that name can mean only one thing: too cowardly to use your real identiy.

    Id quot circumiret, circumveniat

    I have no idea what you speak of, nor do I care.

    ReplyDelete
  40. Pam: I've stayed out of this for a bit (other than to refute some of the stupid claims/lies {euthanasia}) because I don't know enough...today I've just started to venture into these waters. The political waters of healthcare reform are dangerous, and quite daunting...

    First, before giving this medical care to everyone, I think we need to fix the system we have now. Watch "Sicko"...those of us who have insurance are screwed daily by the insurance companies. I don't think the government will be much different. We need to make sure that those of us with medical insurance are taken care of first. Once that system has been fixed, then we can start tackling taking care of everyone.

    ReplyDelete
  41. "The nation's youngest and oldest citizens are suffering the most from a fragmented, wasteful and in some cases dangerous health care system, according to a new study. When compared to nearly two dozen other industrialized countries, the U.S. has the highest infant mortality rate and the lowest life expectancy for people who have reached the age of 60."

    The site you linked that provided that information above has no other links that show who was studied and on what basis they were judged on.

    As far as the other link, I see the statistics that you mentioned in a previous post. The problem is that the numbers are judged against the others without variables considered. Here they are comparing adults age 50 and over and chronic diseases. They fail to mention the ratio of those studied that smoke for instance. They also state obesity is double what it is in these European countries. That is a huge variable. They compare life expectancy but don't mention any of the things used to compare all the countries. Is it just based on who lives longer? Then variables do matter.


    Shaw.....Regardless of the right or wrong of statistics, I will agree with you that our country
    needs some serious help. I think a huge factor is prevention. Eating healthier, exercise, taking care of ourselves so we won't need the doctors!!

    I think we can agree that something needs to be done, we just differ on what we feel needs to be done.



    Truth, I think you have a point! To ridicule something without having something to back it up, tends to weaken your argument. It's easy to criticize something, it's a lot harder to be part of the solution.

    James...I agree completely. Fix the broken system and then we can address the problems that arise after that.
















    "The prevalence of many major chronic diseases among adults age 50 and older is higher in the United States when compared to ten European countries. This includes higher prevalence of heart disease, high blood pressure, high cholesterol, stroke, diabetes, chronic lung disease, arthritis and cancer. Also, the prevalence of obesity in these European countries is approximately half that of the United States. "

    ReplyDelete
  42. "Let me ask this. If you are already a little pessimistic about the government and are questioning the health care bill, why in the heck would you go to a web-site that is created and run by the very people who wrote the bill that you are skeptical about in the first place?"

    Duh, because weez stupid. Our mama's and papa's wuz brother and sister may be. lol

    Bet that is how they really feel about us.

    ReplyDelete
  43. Jennifer; We do not need the governments involvement in this. The federal government has absolutely no Constitutional right or authority to be involved in health care, education, taking over auto manufacturers, taking over banks and insurance companies. They are in violation of the Constitution.

    That is why we are losing our freedoms and rights, because every time we let the federal government get involved in more and more things they do not have the authority to be involved in, the cost to We the People is a lose of more freedoms. It is up to we the people to pressure the health care industry to reform themselves. The answer is not a government takeover.

    ReplyDelete
  44. Rev Gregori: The government also, constitutionally, doesn't have a lot of things if you disregard the amendments. I bet you subscribe to "Sovereign Citizen" ideology as well; the 14th amendment taking away our sovereign citizenship and making us federal/state citizens instead.

    Bull.

    Just like "no Constitutional right or authority to be involved in health care, education, taking over auto manufacturers, taking over banks and insurance companies. They are in violation of the Constitution."

    Bull.

    You might have had a point. But really? No education?

    ReplyDelete
  45. TRUTH 101 said...

    And yet another all American Republican Girl shows her intellectual weakness by refusing to offer a plan of her own. Why am I not surprised.

    And yet YOU ridicule these people!
    You know we are not a elected official and we are not supposed to have a "plan" We do not have 1000's of advisers and we are not paid millions or billions or trillions to come up with a "plan" as the "great one" does.
    Remember that old saying, "if it ain't broken, don't fix it" well my old plan ain't broken!

    ReplyDelete
  46. Truth101, You have perfectly demonstrated the reaction of any lib to a request to rationally justify his/her philosophy.
    No it is NOT out job to provide an alternative plan.
    As Debbie above has said
    "we are not a elected official and we are not supposed to have a "plan" We do not have 1000's of advisers and we are not paid millions to do so"

    That is why we elect politicians. But we expect the officials we elect to do the job to benefit us not to hurt us. Like the disastrous plan Obama has put on the table .
    "Government is not the solution; government is the problem." The 8 most dangerous words in the English language are: "I'm from the government: I'm here to help."
    Rant over. Posts over, since I'm not going to argue back and forth over the same thing, unless you have something constructive to say other than we should provide you with a plan.
    That is not up to us to do.

    ReplyDelete
  47. Right is Right just posted this:
    "That is not up to us to do"


    Why is it not our job to tell our lawmakers what we want RIR? That is free speech. Incredibly, you and your friend claim you don't need an alternative. Yes you do. Unless you want to rermain mindless sheep you need think for yourself instead of waiting for the next talking point from Rush or Glenn.
    :

    ReplyDelete
  48. TRUTH 101 said...
    "And yet another all American Republican Girl shows her intellectual weakness by refusing to offer a plan of her own. Why am I not surprised."



    So FALSE101 is not surprised!
    Well isn't that enlightening... Ans who cives a crap!

    Listen FALSE Dude!
    Just as the young ladies said, we are not the Phony Tax cheating advisers that the Zippo appointed and it's not up to us to come up with a plan. If Zippo want to "Change" things let him "Change" things for the better not come up with a plan that 3/4 of the American people are against. We don't want his STINKEN "Change"
    Get it?

    ReplyDelete
  49. The FALSE dude just said

    "instead of waiting for the next talking point from Rush or Glenn."

    Why don't you change your broken record, it's getting very boring and meaningless.
    And pretty damn dumb.

    ReplyDelete
  50. On another note! The Obama administration's call for Internet-users to flag "fishy" e-mails or websites opposing health-care reform legislation has sparked charges that the administration is engaging in "Chicago" politics. The use of this metaphor has gone hand in hand with speculation that the administration might use the data thus gathered to compile an "enemies list." But if one considers what the administration has actually done

    El Presidente 0bama is: untruthful, Marxist, Communist, liberal, boastful, secretive, democrat, incompetent, unqualified, spend-thrift, socialist, racist.

    I'm waiting to see how the White House spins this!

    ReplyDelete
  51. No the US does not have the best health care in the world. And yes the US does not have all the answers. And YES the people here on this forum do not and should NOT have all the answers either. The US is full of liberal idiots who cannot think for themselves and will believe whatever the "CHOSEN ONE" and what the loudest blowhard in the media tells them to. The toilet needs to be flushed and all the president's koolaide drinkers need to be flushed down with the rest of the crap that he has been feeding us.

    ReplyDelete
  52. REV. GREGORI TYPED: "The federal government has absolutely no Constitutional right or authority to be involved in health care,"

    Tell that to the millions of seniors who are covered by Medicare and to our military whom the federal government insures.

    Would you expect our fighting men and women who go into highly hazardous and highly risky combat zones to be able to buy insurance from profit-driven insurance companies? Really? How about our grannys and grampys. Medicare has given our seniors the ability to live through the last years of their lives in dignity and security. Would you like to take that away from them?

    As for your claim that the federal government has no constitional authority to be involved in health care:


    The way this country works is that Congress introduces legislation and if the president doesn't veto it (or if the Congress overrides that veto) that bill becomes a law--that's how we got Medicare. And it is entirely constitutional.

    ReplyDelete
  53. "El Presidente 0bama is: untruthful, Marxist, Communist, liberal, boastful, secretive, democrat, incompetent, unqualified, spend-thrift, socialist, racist."--Frank TTM

    "The US is full of liberal idiots who cannot think for themselves and will believe whatever the "CHOSEN ONE" and what the loudest blowhard in the media tells them to. The toilet needs to be flushed and all the president's koolaide drinkers need to be flushed down with the rest of the crap that he has been feeding us."--Yung Dre


    I had to smile to myself when I read those two comments. Over the past weeks, I've had several conservative folks come to my blog and complain to me about the name-calling and the anti-conservative posts on my blog and in my comments.

    It appears that there are an infinite number of pots calling the kettle black in the blogsphere, but I did want to point out how silly those people who complain about name-calling truly are.

    ReplyDelete
  54. Conservative Black WomanAugust 12, 2009 at 8:43 AM

    The scary truth is Ms. Shaw Kenawe that Mr. Obama is willing to say anything to get his way. We are in a big mess and there is almost no chance of getting out of it in time to save our country. But he and his administration are full of smoke and mirrors. Go on and laugh at that you have been reading here, but it is real, you who are laughing are the problem. You have put this man in office and now the American people are stuck with him and his socialistic ideas. Well go ahead and laugh, I for one will do whatever I can to fight him and his foolishness. It's about time we stood up to him and revolt.
    "how silly those people who complain"
    Well I think not.


    And here is one way to start.

    http://standupforamerica.com/

    Get aboard as BHO would say!

    ReplyDelete
  55. Well, laugh all you want, you Liberals are all the same, you name call up the gazoole and then complain when someone else doe it back.
    You may laugh at the claims of the as you call them "Birthers" or scratch your heads at the other posters here.
    But I for one as a a true conservative won't be going back to your blog ever again...Period.

    ReplyDelete
  56. Dear "Black Conservative Woman,"

    You completely misread my comment.

    Please go back and re-read it to understand that I SMILED at the people who complained about name-calling, and then used name-calling.

    I did not LAUGH at anyone.

    You did not read my comment--or worse, you deliberately misinterpreted it to get make your point. Please don't do that. That is dishonest.

    See?

    Frank TTM, instead of reading my comment, read yours and believed your inaccuracies.

    See how rumors and untruths are spread.

    Pamela,

    Every time I come here to comment, this happens. Someone deliberately misreads or unintentionally misreads my comment. This is a dishonest way to discredit people who have a differing point of view.

    If you look again at my comment, I said I SMILED at the people who used name-calling [not at me], but to describe either the president or liberals. I said absolutely nothing about LAUGHING at anyone.

    Nevermind.

    I really believe trying to have a discussion with people who bring deliberately misrepresent what I say is useless.

    This has nothing to do with you, Pamela, or Jennifer, neither of you do this. You both actually address my comments with intelligence and good arguments to counter what I say.

    ReplyDelete
  57. Shaw Kenawe said... Nevermind.

    I really believe trying to have a discussion with people who bring deliberately misrepresent what I say is useless.

    Well then what else did this mean:
    "I had to smile to myself when I read those two comments"

    ReplyDelete
  58. My, this has gotten quite a few comments. Probably because Health Care IS extremely important and affects ALL of us.

    I would love to hear what you all think we need to do to FIX the problem. Also, maybe we could stay on topic and comment on the “Realty Check” we-site. Or is it REALLY unconstitutional to implement this Health Care plan? I’m not a Constitutional expert, but there are a few readers here who are….

    ReplyDelete
  59. I am a Native New Hampshirite. Unless you were raised there you would not understand.
    But that was the most phony stacked town hall meeting in history.
    1st, people were not happy. If you look at this video from WMUR, NH’s only national media affiliate (ABC,) you will see that the Real NH people were relegated to the student parking lot across the street from Portsmouth HS, while the Obama supporters were allowed directly in front of the High School. And it was raining.

    http://www.wmur.com/video/20358253/index.html
    2nd check the more conservative way the NH people were dressed – much less skin showing. Even the reporter was dressed NH style. Then note the amount of flesh showing on the Obama supporters. Bluntly put, the Obama Supporters were “bussed” in and are NOT NH people. Also, the people allowed in the High School auditorium all wore the Organize for America buttons and were “friendlies”. Looking at that audience it is very doubtful that very many of those people are from NH, as many were “overdressed”. Also, NH people do NOT wear buttons as a general rule. Our fiends and neighbors know our feelings. But these people deal every 4 years with the invasion of the national media who treat them like peasants, and literally follow them home and constantly harass them. So, NH people do NOT advertise their opinions with buttons as we dislike the national media very much.
    REAL town hall meetings are an honored tradition and a matter of pride. The meetings themselves are usually quite contentious. After the meeting, everyone shares breads, pies and other baked goods provided by the women, as well as, tea, coffee, or even a beer, and hard feelings are soothed over. Everyone goes home knowing they are all, inclusively, part of the community. Unless you grew up there, you will never understand how close, warm and deep that community feeling is.
    William Kostric’s message was very simple -”FU Obama you are NOT taking our liberties away and we KNOW you are making a mockery of our traditions with your phony town hall meetings and fake audience. And Kostric is right, most NH males do own guns and hunting and fishing in season are favorite “man” things to do.
    Lastly, listen to how erudite, educated, Kostric is. He knew his history and corrected Matthews a few times on the sequence and order of things. Kostric also knew quotes from the founding fathers verbatim.
    NH people DO NOT turn into mobs or crazies. When they get angry, they speak with their neighbors and members of their community and figure out the most logical and common sense way to “get even” in a figure of speech. Kostric was simply stating his opinion by dress, and his sign. The only ones freaking out were the out of staters we call “Outlanders” or “Flatlanders”.
    But there is more. During this August congressional recess, the Democrats will be making a full court press to rally support for Obama's sagging health care plans, and they will take no prisoners in the process. Disagree with Obama on health care? If so, then your "phony" concerns might just get you on the White House "enemies" list. You may also face increased pressure at town hall meetings.
    Obama and the Democrats have faced a wave of angry Americans, and clearly they were not prepared for the opposition. Apparently, they think everyone is just in love with them and their policies to transform America into a socialist state. Democrat legislators have clearly not been ready for their own townhall meetings where constituents voiced their anger and concern with the big spending, big government actions of Obama and Congress.
    How has Obama and his team responded? Simple. First, they are trying to discredit the opposition. According to them, "good" Americans favor the health care takeover, while "bad" Americans do not. Second, there is intimidation. The White House is actually building a database of those opposed to Obama's plans, and they are encouraging Americans to report on other Americans. That is scary!
    Hopefully I explained my state and its culture so everyone understands.

    ReplyDelete
  60. Sorry for the double posting, I'm new at this and I made a mistake.. Please delete the duplicate.
    And thank you for allowing me to express my opinion.

    ReplyDelete
  61. Hey Truthie 101 Genius, when you understand more about the theory, practice and history of healthcare and how business work...come back. until then, please don't waste any more bandwidth.

    Your ignorance is scary and laughable.

    ReplyDelete
  62. TRUTH 101 said...
    And I am still waiting for alternative health insurance plans from all my right leaning friends except Pamela and Jennifer. At the very least could one of you show some get up and go and at least say "yeah. What those two said.



    As usual, another kool aid worshiping socialist Democrat who has it wrong and blows his own horn. This is what Democrats bring to America every time they are elected...
    Now that HUSSEIN OBAMA AND DEMOCRATS have being elected.. Look for disaster to reign supreme. I stated this the day of Obama's inauguration.

    And look for people like Truth101 to act like a pinhead.

    ReplyDelete
  63. Google "Truth about Cuban Healthcare"...it helps.
    here is just one: http://www.nationalreview.com/nordlinger/nordlinger_cuba7-30-07.asp

    Then email Andy Garcia and Gloria Estefan ....ask people who REALLY KNOW and LEFT. (or Ask Michael Moore?) ! OR CASTRO?

    The thing almost nobody seems to be asking is WHY THE HURRY? Germany's government(the one that did almost nothing , against Obama's suggestions to them about STIMULATING their economy and is the "European country", as the media calls it now, bouncing back amazingly quickly and well) takes up to a YEAR in discussion when complete overhauls are suggested in ANY bill or law. This ONE SIXTH of our country's finances and we're rushing!?? With really objectionable points in it? Why don't we COUNT, those of us who just want ANSWERS?

    If both sides were properly listened to and people could give input AFTER the WH FINALLY and TOTALLY did tell the truth about the program, maybe all of this rancor wouldn't have happened?

    The Obama "Fight the Smears" (Why "SMEARS", why the punk disdain words?) are just more of the same being given at Town Hall meetings!
    Like YOU CAN KEEP YOUR PRIVATE INSURANCE. The biggest lie going, folks.
    Ask about how your bank accounts will be available to this government so they can deduct your medical care from that...ask and see what they'll say.

    WAIT. STOP. THINK. READ, the Republicans DO have ideas that Bush had back in the day: Ways to help Soc Security, co-ops for small businesses, health savings plans and more; for anyone to deny they have plans means you've been listening to the msm far too long and not getting the truth.

    ReplyDelete
  64. Pam: To answer your question, I believe Shaw hit it on the head. Constitutionally, if Congress passes the law and the president signs it into law, it is Constitutional as long as it doesn't infringe on some other part of the Constitution.

    Therefore, if a law is passed that increases taxes but insures all of us, it is Constitutional.

    ReplyDelete
  65. THIS president will do whatever HE wants to do,and HE will do whatever it takes to do it.
    That my friends is called ARROGANCE

    Once again, as in Rev. Wright and H. Gates, we see the president stepping all over the rest of the people.
    I wish that someone would remind him that he is the president and not the King!

    ReplyDelete
  66. I am appalled at the total destruction of our economy, The debt You Barrack Hussien Obama have increased more in last 8 months than ANY other administration did in entire term, WHO IS GOING TO PAY IT?? The USA was founded on Christian beliefs, The Constitution gaurentees freedom OF religion, not freedom FROM, or Imposed on us, as you seem to be imposing islam on this country,
    President Obama has done nothing for this country but make things worse. He is a liar when he said he wants to end the war, when in actuality, troops numbers overseas have only increased.
    This man is out of control. He loves to spend tax payers money to the tune of trillions. Wants to spend more. Tax the "rich" small business that are the backbone of this country. Gave terrorists rights the first day in office. He is the "Joker". Socialism is a real threat.
    This man is an usurper and an egotist. His policies destroy our American values and promote socialism. He is an embarrassment to our Country.
    He is trying to make America a socialist country, and he needs to get out of office NOW!

    ReplyDelete
  67. Um, Socialism and Islam are mutually exclusive, if not incompatible, moogie.

    Not to mention off-topic.

    ReplyDelete
  68. James' Muse said...
    Um, Socialism and Islam are mutually exclusive, if not incompatible, moogie.
    Not to mention off-topic.


    Um, I just read your blog Jamie, and If I were you, I wouldn't correct ANYBODY!

    ReplyDelete
  69. Ask about how your bank accounts will be available to this government so they can deduct your medical care from that...ask and see what they'll say.

    Here's what we'll say:

    THIS IS A NOT TRUE.

    "The House bill says that one of the goals for electronic health records is to "enable electronic funds transfers, in order to allow automated reconciliation" between payment and billing. But it describes common electronic banking transactions, not special access privileges for the government."

    Source: NYTimes, Aug. 12, 2009, Pg. A14, Congressional bills, and Politifact

    ReplyDelete
  70. It's as simple as this:

    I want the SAME healthcare that Obama and the rest of Congress have, nothing more, nothing less.
    No rationed care, less doctors available, no nationalized medical matrix chart that one has to wade through to get healthcare.

    No extra bureaucrats that I have to pay to administer this Nationalized Healthcare. Not only will I be rationed health care, I will have to pay the salary, pension benefits of these new bureaucrats hired to fill the maze of departments to administer this healthcare...but I also will be paying for their "special congressional healthcare.

    That ain't right.

    Truthie101 wants to know if anyone has another suggestion for Healthcare..
    Fix Medicaid and Medicare and shelve this idiotic plan forever. It will only put a tax on all of us, because we will have to wait in line foe real medical help when someone else has a cut finger.
    If the government runs his healthcare system like they run the United States Post Office ...We are in big trouble. I want my Doctor to tell me if I need surgery or not, not a snake oil salesman.

    ReplyDelete
  71. Moogie: That means nothing. Just another snarky comment when you can't refute something.

    Good try. Fail.

    ReplyDelete
  72. Frank: The problem is that right now your doctors aren't making the decisions.

    Private insurance companies are.

    What you are attributing to ObamaCare already is in place under capitalism and greedy buggers in insurance skyrises.

    ReplyDelete
  73. To all arguing with Shaw, why bother? Her entire site can be found at:

    http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/3036677/

    It's the same rhetoric and where she really gets all of her talking points.

    That wasn't a personal attack, just an astute observation.

    While I'm here, anyone hear the doubletalk AARP is putting out there?

    obamacare support is slipping. Congressional approval is slipping as well. Presidential approval rating is slipping, too. You can't chalk all of this up to the work a five talk show hosts anymore.

    People don't want this. I am also tired of idiots making comparisons of universal healthcare to our military. They HAVE to take care of the military. They kinda defend the country and bail out other needy countries who then spit on us.

    ReplyDelete
  74. James' Muse said...
    Frank: The problem is that right now your doctors aren't making the decisions.
    Private insurance companies are.

    What you are attributing to ObamaCare already is in place under capitalism and greedy buggers in insurance skyrises.

    If I could answer for Frank..
    I don't know about YOUR doctor, but mine does.

    ReplyDelete
  75. Sergeant: You are military. Your doctor is paid by the government.

    Mine isn't. Mine is paid by private insurance, who calls the shots.

    ReplyDelete
  76. The absolute lunacy of a few people make trying to debate health care reform nearly impossible. It's best to ignore absurd statements such as this:

    The Constitution gaurentees freedom OF religion, not freedom FROM, or Imposed on us, as you [Mr. Obama] seem to be imposing islam on this country,

    since the writer offers only wild imaginings from his/her synapsing dendrites and nothing else.

    But when the same writer splatters this sort of venom in a public forum:

    This man is an usurper and an egotist. His policies destroy our American values and promote socialism. He is an embarrassment to our Country.
    He is trying to make America a socialist country, and he needs to get out of office NOW!


    I really do feel it should be countered.

    Sir or Madam Moogiep,

    The man you call a "usurper" was constitutionally elected by a majority of Americans 9 months ago. A duly elected president is in no way a usurper. You apparently use words of which you do not know the meaning. The rest of your rant is easily ignored for its meaningless turgidity except for the last inanity.

    Mr. Obama was elected to serve a 4-year term, and however infuriated you are with this inescapable fact, he will continue to be our president for the next 3 years and 3 months, that is, unless you have a plan that the Secret Service would be interested in hearing.

    ReplyDelete
  77. James' Muse
    Don't answer like such a wise ass.
    For a little punk you have a lot to say!
    But it all boils down to horse shit.

    ReplyDelete
  78. Branny Johnson:

    I wasn't being a wiseass. I was countering someone's wiseass remark instead of refuting my argument.

    So again, instead of refuting my arguments, someone new attacks me personally.

    Another epic fail.

    Try again.

    ReplyDelete
  79. Pam: As for believing government, I don't view them as evil or anything like that, so I'll trust [some] of their refutations of lies. Example: Euthanasia. Nowhere whatsoever does it say anything related to this in the bill. But the lie is circulating nonetheless. So when Obama goes up there, and says "that is a lie," and I've read page 425, I believe him there.

    But I tend to trust places like Snopes or Factcheck.org more than the government site.

    ReplyDelete
  80. WHEN THE GOING GETS TOUGH FOR LIBS

    they resort to lies and attacks.
    This is the SAME CROWD that gave us Porkulous AGAINST OUR WILL! This is the SAME crowd that STILL Pisses away OUR MONEY like it was booze going down Ted Kennedy's throat! Now they're buying 8 luxury Gulf stream jets at $550 million per. so that their fat asses can fly in comfort.

    ReplyDelete
  81. Sergeant: Again, you are changing the subject. Stop with the partisan attacks.

    About the jets you are so mad about: they aren't being bought.

    ReplyDelete
  82. James' Muse said...

    Pam: As for believing government, I don't view them as evil or anything like that, so I'll trust [some] of their refutations of lies. Example: Euthanasia. Nowhere whatsoever does it say anything related to this in the bill. But the lie is circulating nonetheless. So when Obama goes up there, and says "that is a lie," and I've read page 425, I believe him there.

    But I tend to trust places like Snopes or Factcheck.org more than the government site.



    LOL, if you have to check what he say on Snopes or Factcheck. Then it sounds to me as if you Don't trust him ..

    AND WHO WOULD, HE IS SUCH A LAIR.

    ReplyDelete
  83. Sergeant York the Anti Obama Czar said...
    WHEN THE GOING GETS TOUGH FOR LIBS

    they resort to lies and attacks.
    This is the SAME CROWD that gave us Porkulous AGAINST OUR WILL! This is the SAME crowd that STILL Pisses away OUR MONEY like it was booze going down Ted Kennedy's throat! Now they're buying 8 luxury Gulf stream jets at $550 million per. so that their fat asses can fly in comfort.




    Actually, no.

    WASHINGTON -- House leaders late Monday dropped plans to spend $550 million on Air Force passenger planes for use by senior government officials, a sum that more than doubled the Pentagon's official request and had drawn strong public criticism.

    "If the Department of Defense does not want these aircraft, they will be eliminated from the bill," said Rep. John Murtha (D., Pa.), the chairman of the House panel that sought the aircraft order.

    The House will seek only $220 million to purchase one Gulfstream plane and three Boeing Co. aircraft, which was the original request by Department of Defense officials.

    Wall Street Journal

    ReplyDelete
  84. Right is Right: I don't trust any politician. I check most things on factcheck. I started doing that during the debates last year, finding that McCain and Obama both embellished.

    My point is that while I don't completely distrust government, I don't completely trust it either.

    ReplyDelete
  85. Shaw said:

    "If the Department of Defense does not want these aircraft, they will be eliminated from the bill," said Rep. John Murtha (D., Pa.), the chairman of the House panel that sought the aircraft order.

    The House will seek only $220 million to purchase one Gulfstream plane and three Boeing Co. aircraft, which was the original request by Department of Defense officials.


    Yes, correct, BUT this happened AFTER all the protest about it.

    And did you know that Congress people generally fly on military jets, where members of the Armed Services carry bags and take drink orders. When flying on military jets, lawmakers are permitted to bring along spouses at no cost.

    Sorry Sarge for answering for this for you.
    But you can add to this..

    ReplyDelete
  86. Hey Libbies...Feeling stimulated yet?

    ReplyDelete
  87. I thought for a moment that Frank the Thinking Man would live up to his chosen decripition and offer an alternative plan to mine but he thought about it and decided not to do anything rash. He patriotically said he wanted the same plan Congress gets. He just doesn't want to pay for it.


    Still, other than Pamela and Jennifer, no right leaners have offered anything.

    ReplyDelete
  88. RiR wrote:

    And did you know that Congress people generally fly on military jets, where members of the Armed Services carry bags and take drink orders. When flying on military jets, lawmakers are permitted to bring along spouses at no cost.

    No. I didn't know that. Apparently this happened under both Democratic and Republican administrations. Were you angry about it when the, say, Bush administration Congresscritter did this too?

    ReplyDelete
  89. The problem, as you pointed out Shaw, is that this debate keeps turning into a "blame Obama/Democrats" for everything that is wrong with our country. Just as they are doing with the jets; they keep changing the subject from healthcare to what they hate about Democrats. Another example: a few comments above. "Hey libbies...Feeling stimulated..."

    In lieu of debate, snark.

    ReplyDelete
  90. TRUTH 101 said...

    I thought for a moment that Frank the Thinking Man would live up to his chosen decripition and offer an alternative plan to mine but he thought about it and decided not to do anything rash. He patriotically said he wanted the same plan Congress gets. He just doesn't want to pay for it.


    Still, other than Pamela and Jennifer, no right leaners have offered anything.

    Hey Falseie, WHO SAID I DON'T WANT TO PAY FOR IT?
    I pay now so why would I expect Mr. Zipo to give me a hand out. I NEVER asked for anything free like the dopers on the corner who voted for Mr. Zip.
    So if you are going to quote me, do it correctly as Ms. Shaw would say, "Do you have reading a comprehension problem?

    ReplyDelete
  91. Well I've been reading this bolg and it's comments for about 1/2 an hour now. And It's my turn to say something.. As far as what James' Muse said...

    The problem, as you pointed out Shaw, is that this debate keeps turning into a "blame Obama/Democrats" for everything that is wrong with our country. Just as they are doing with the jets; they keep changing the subject from healthcare to what they hate about Democrats.



    And for your information the one that changed the subject form Healthcare to Jets was Shaw Kenawe.


    Another example: a few comments above. "Hey libbies...Feeling stimulated..."

    In lieu of debate, snark.
    Are we going to take anything that some troll like JohnB316 said as an example and take what he said as an example of anything real..
    If so lets go to Shaws blog and look at ALL the LIB 's NASTY name callers there and we could start with that Moondog Christopher,to Arthurstone and the Truth dude and go down the line to your old buddy Time..

    ReplyDelete
  92. IMTSI:

    Actually, it was Sergeant York that changed the subject. And here you are doing the same to trash on Shaw, which Pam does not want on her blog.

    A few right-wingers here keep trying to change the subject from healthcare to hating on dems...Here to Say it, you are doing it too.

    ReplyDelete
  93. So, back on healthcare:

    I would like to see some sort of regulation where insurance companies may not decide what care to deny or not...example: my sister's doctor told my parents she needed an MRI. Their insurance denied it, claiming that an MRI would be "experimental" which is BULL. My parents paid out of pocket, and found a life-threatening disease that most likely would have killed my sister had they not done the MRI and found it in time to treat it.

    This is the problem with private insurance. I don't know if this would go away with public insurance, but my guess is that it wouldn't.

    This needs to be fixed first. Otherwise, such things will happen to the [now]uninsured, too.

    ReplyDelete
  94. James' Muse said...

    The problem, as you pointed out Shaw, is that this debate keeps turning into a "blame Obama/Democrats" for everything that is wrong with our country.


    Well DUH! Yes! Isn't Obama and his plan what we are talking about?
    Don't let the facts get in your way..

    Obama says no taxes on those making less than $250,000. Why is no one mentioning that when the Bush Tax cuts expire, we will all realize tax increases. Inaction is a tax increase. Anyone in the lower end of middle class will realize at least $2000 in tax increases. Unless someone extends these tax cuts we are all in trouble! Why isn't anyone talking about this? Because if they told you that you'd know the Great Messiah-- that's what Louis Farrakhan calls him-- is a liar and a fraud, and it would be undeniable. Although his supporters would still deny it. Like they will now.
    If I see another Volkswagen here in town with a “Hope/Change/Yes we can/Obama” sticker on it I’m going to scream!

    ReplyDelete
  95. You are in a position that either you get health insurance through your employer, or you are well off and can afford it on your own. Either waay Frank, I'm happy for you. I want everyone to have decent health insurance and everyone to help pay for it. My best answer is a single payer system. Your's is keeping what you have and offering no solution for those that don't. Does that sum up your position accurately Frank?

    ReplyDelete
  96. And for your information the one that changed the subject form Healthcare to Jets was Shaw Kenawe.--I'm Here To Say It

    Um, no.

    Sergeant York the Anti Obama Czar said...
    WHEN THE GOING GETS TOUGH FOR LIBS

    they resort to lies and attacks.
    This is the SAME CROWD that gave us Porkulous AGAINST OUR WILL! This is the SAME crowd that STILL Pisses away OUR MONEY like it was booze going down Ted Kennedy's throat! Now they're buying 8 luxury Gulf stream jets at $550 million per. so that their fat asses can fly in comfort.

    August 12, 2009 2:34 PM



    You have a reading..., well, you know.

    ReplyDelete
  97. Debbie says: "Inaction is a tax increase."

    Inaction through lies and misleading statements is the strategy emloyed by the Republican for everything it seems. As a right leaner, you should be proud at how well this is working for your side.

    ReplyDelete
  98. Because we aren't talking about tax cuts here...and "inaction" isn't a tax increase...it's like a coupon expiring. You wouldn't say a restaurant raised its prices just because your coupon expired.

    But you are doing the same thing, Debbie. Moving the discussion from healthcare to what you hate about Obama. Just like Sergeant did with his tirade about a non-existant purchase that Congress never made.
    IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH HEALTHCARE.

    ReplyDelete
  99. This comment has been removed by the author.

    ReplyDelete
  100. OK, I'll talk about healtcare to please Mr. James...At the New Hampshire staged event, Obama once again showed his ignorance and anti-doctor prejudice as he did 2 weeks ago with that ridiculous charge that doctors would perform tonsillectomies instead of treating sore throats because they would be paid more money for tonsillectomies.

    The elderly have been paying taxes all of their lives. When they finally need something from the government, it's not cost-effective to give it to them. Good news, Grandpa, the doctor will give you a free pill as your end-of-life plan.
    And James can I still talk about how much I hate Obama? The two really go together. Aw, what the hell I'll do it anyway. I don't really care what you think..
    I fully believe that what scares the bejesus out of the Democrats is that they are coming up against righteous anger. It isn't an anger born out of racial hatred or partisian hatred, it is a righteous anger born from the inherant need and desire of American's to be free.

    For those pundits that encourage "quiet" and thoughtful debate, I would like to ask them that if they were a victim of a home invasion, watching the thugs steal their belongings and threaten their families, would they try to sit down in "thoughtful debate" with them? The left is trying to steal our freedom and our country. It's time to get loud and active.

    The more people read the details (or at least have someone point them out to them), the less ObamaCare is liked. That's why he and the Democrats wanted to force this down our throats until it was too late to reverse course.

    Keep it up, America! You are winning this battle. Send the Marxists back Kenya where he came from.
    The ignorance of Obama and Democrats who are demonizing the American people in thinking that any government can borrow and spend its way out of a recession is dangerous. Their ignorance in thinking that the American people are stupid enough to just sit back and let them continue this AND take over health care forcing it down our throats without freedom loving Americans rising against this tyranny will also be their ultimate undoing.
    Mark my words Mr. Obama you will be accountable to us and this uprising by the people will not be quelled, it will not be stopped. You can flag us and investigate us. You can call out your goon squads and organize your mobs all you want. We know that we are still your boss and as your boss just as we have since the beginning of this great Nation we will not let tyranny stand.

    We will not sit back and let you take over our health care. We will not sit back and let you bankrupt our Nation. We will not sit back and let you destroy our children’s future. We are the American people and we are the power and authority of this country and will prevail because freedom demands it and freedom will lead the way in our opposition to you and your tyranny.

    Now I'm going to a couple of Advils and try to sleep off the headaches that James gave me.

    ReplyDelete
  101. Wow, IMTSI. I sure get to you, giving you headaches and all, asking you to actually think.

    Too bad it didn't help. There is no euthanasia in this plan. There is no "end of life plan" pill.

    fully believe that what scares the bejesus out of the Democrats is that they are coming up against righteous anger.

    No, what scares people is ignorance. You are coming from ingnorant anger, as you showed with your "euthanasia" claim.

    You know what else scares me? The fact that you, and many like you, keep talking about "rising up" against tyranny, as if you would [could] actually overthrow our government. The fact is, IHTSI, you are mad that a democrat is in office. THAT'S all. All your talk of "tyranny" is bull. Where were you when the PATRIOT act allowed the government to listen in to your phone calls? Where were you when it gave the government the right to see what you checked out at libraries? Tyranny? Try the John Yoo Memos.

    And by the way, were you to actually try and overthrow the government because of some misguided thought, you would no doubt end up executed for treason. The US military is the greatest in the world. And they would not revolt against their commander in chief.

    Enough of this kind of talk, IHTSI. It doesn't help. It just makes the rest of us Republicans look like loons.

    ReplyDelete
  102. From dictionary.com:

    Tyranny:
    1.arbitrary or unrestrained exercise of power; despotic abuse of authority.
    2. the government or rule of a tyrant or absolute ruler.
    3. a state ruled by a tyrant or absolute ruler.
    4. oppressive or unjustly severe government on the part of any ruler.
    5. undue severity or harshness.
    6. a tyrannical act or proceeding.

    Obama has many limits on his power. I don't see absolute ruling anywhere.

    From wikipedia:
    In classical politics, a tyrant is one who has taken power by their own means as opposed to hereditary or constitutional power. This mode of rule is referred to as tyranny.

    The word derives from Latin tyrannus, meaning "illegitimate ruler", and from a non-Indo-European loan word in Greek, τύραννος tyrannos, meaning "sovereign, master", although the latter was not pejorative and applicable to both good and bad leaders alike.


    Hmm...Obama was ELECTED. So, no tyranny there, either.

    ReplyDelete
  103. James,

    You can take that meaning literally, or you can understand the implication of a tyrannical leader:

    To me a tyrant is one that makes a grab for more and more power. obama is certainly that and he has taken advantage of an uncertain situation; the recession as a certain way to expand government control.

    To put it bluntly, he's got many of you brainwashed into believing he isn't the potential tyrant/dictator.

    But keep supporting him, it's fun to watch the loyal go down with a sinking ship. When you ally with the side of true vitriol, you make yourself one of them.

    These honest conservative and libertarian bloggers have what I think of as honest anger. They have a right to it, also as many of them will be paying for this debacle as will the generations that follow.

    obama stages phony questions and fake townhalls and watches his ratings slip further and leaves his ideological congressional members out there flapping. That says plenty about his character. Furthermore, the way many of these democrat congresspeople are responding to their constituents shows that they need to 'move on'.

    ReplyDelete
  104. That's fine, Blue. But constantly touting "overthrowing" or other such nonsense gives credence to the left's belief that all conservatives are "wing-nuts." Not true. You said yourself, you don't view yourself as right-wing, but merely conservative. I'm there, too, but on different issues.

    I'm Here to Say It has a lot of anger; but he seems to aim at it whomever he meets that may or may not disagree with him.

    Also, many people, who disagree with Obama (which is fine) manifest that in ways that only hurt the party. When someone starts talking about healthcare reform and a bunch of conservatives can do nothing but shout about socialism, or planes, or whatever non-related grievances they may have, they are doing nothing but reinforcing the negative image of hillbilly's our party has made the last couple of years.

    It isn't helpful.

    As for tyranny: Obama isn't grabbing more power. He simply has a filibuster-proof majority. He hasn't done anything that the Executive Branch isn't authorized to do. Expansion of government isn't tyranny, its merely the democratic party. Just as during the last admin, the government may have grown smaller but its power increased.

    ReplyDelete
  105. No James, you're missing my point.

    He has taken advantage of a situation, as his hit-man Rahm Emmanuel says, "You can't let a good crisis go to waste..."

    He has taken over the auto industry for the most part, now he is going for medicine.

    I understand what my brothers and sisters are experiencing. They don't want to pay for other people's healthcare under a government that can't even handle cash for clunkers and is spending stimulus in all the wrong places. So, if they are angry and disagree with you, more power to them.

    I could site examples from not-so-far in our blogging past where many of these lefties have used tactics much worse. I think that people being angry when others don't listen to their concerns is fine. I also think that anyone who looks to the government to solve people's problems only increases the government's claim on us.

    ReplyDelete
  106. As much and you and the right likes to complain about the auto industry bailout, think of the economic disaster that would have occured had it not taken over. All the auto plants closed and thousands more out of work. All benefits junked. All those people on unemployment and public aid. All their parts supplier having to undergo massive layoffs. Parts prices skyrocketing because parts suppliers don't have the demand so they have to make up for loss of unit sales through higher prices. All the dealers out of business and all the mechanics. Sales staff and support staff unemployed.

    Just because something sounds like what the right wants to hear doesn't make it the correct thing to do.

    ReplyDelete
  107. Is that so truth?

    Who pulled your chain anyway?

    You still have yet to answer other people's questions on here before you comment on my discussion with James.

    Do that first, please, then I'll discuss with you.

    In the meantime, perhaps you might want to consider the fact that US car sales are down because they cost so much due to giving so many concessions to the damn UAW.

    ReplyDelete
  108. Duh. This IS all about Obama. The man said in 2003 "I happen to be a proponent of a single payer universal health care program... A single payer health care plan, a universal health care plan. And that's what I'd like to see. But as all of you know, we may not get there immediately..."

    He now chooses Cass Sunstein as his Regulatory czar to review and shape all major federal regulations. This man has said "I urge that the government should indeed focus on life years rather than lives. A program that saves young people produces more welfare than one that saves old people."

    Who is Obama's chosen science advisor? John Holdren. Co-author in 1977 of Ecoscience, a book that advocates forced abortions, mass sterilization through food and water supply, mandatory implants to prevent pregnancy...You get the idea.

    Who else has Obama chosen to be a Healthcare policy consultant? Ezekiel Immanuel. Go google his ideas on the "complete lives system" favoring only those aged 15-40.

    So Obama says yesterday that "I have not said I am a single payer supporter." Liar.

    He has Linda Douglass tell us that quoting him from 2003 is "out of context...disinformation". Liar.

    His arrogance knows no bounds. "I WILL sign a universal health care plan into law." Aug 2008 campaign
    "Health care WILL be done by the end of the year." 7/20/09, 8/11/09, etc. etc.

    Every scary thing I have heard, every single thing, is True according to my interpretation of this bill - and the interpretation of many, many other highly educated people. Just because Obama and his people say it isn't true, sorry, they are LIARS. Then they call anyone opposed to them:

    "political terrorists" - Dem Rep Baron Hill - Indiana

    "like the KKK" - Dem Rep John Dingell - Michigan

    "un-American angry mobs" - Nancy Pelosi

    And the President of the United States plants little girls in town hall meetings to lob him softball questions and blames his sinking popularity on cable news.

    Bush had the pomposity to act like he had a mandate from the people to push his agenda when he lost the freakin' popular vote. But President Bush for all his faults, never blamed his problems on MSNBC! Good Lord. This guy really thinks that Fox News and talk radio is the only reason people object to his grand plans.

    So, it doesn't matter what plans conservatives come up with. Obama is going to push this thing through. He ended that 2003 statement with "first we have to take back the White House, we have to take back the Senate, and we have to take back the House.”

    Then all you have to do is hire policy consultants and a regulatory czar to hide the details in a 1000+ page bill, tell a bunch of Congressmen too lazy to read it that it's not what it actually is, bully them into signing it quick before the first recess and so the public can't figure it out before it's too late, and your big health care wet dreams come true. Just like that.

    He is stumbling. But he is determined. And he will have it his way. He will do ANYTHING to make sure he gets his way on this.

    ReplyDelete
  109. James' Muse; Please try reading the Constitution, especially the TENTH Amendment.

    ReplyDelete
  110. James' Muse said" what scares people is ignorance"

    James the only "ignorance" here has been your posts!Are you off your meds or are you going somewhere with this rambling?

    You seem to chastise everyone here and in MY view YOU don't know YOUR ass from your elbow about anything you are saying.
    These bozos have a free pass with a complete Dum-O-Crat majority in both houses and STILL these loosers can't find people experienced enough or honest enough to fill the positions. This ship sank the day Obama was sworn in. To say our republic is in peril for it's life is an understatement. You can't make thes crap up! It is almost as if they *want* our nation to fall. And thats how socialism is brought in..

    There is no way any self respecting democrat can look at this gigantic mess and claim the "change" the slick obama campain promised has even the slightest chance of happening. Talk about the blind leading the blind!

    I see 2 possibilities: either obumah is a stupid jackass who is incapable of connecting the dots in a children's coloring book much less understanding that not raising taxes on 95% of this country's workers and stealing even more money from these same Americans by raising the taxes on companies which produce such important products as coal, gasoline and electricity are contrary policies.Barak Obama is a one-termer and keeps proving it by his cave-ins against each and every campaign promise. Healthcare in the USA, will NEVER again be Affordable and there are 50 million of us out there to prove it.
    Obama's healthcare plan proposes to cut Medicare by the billions which will lead to an increase in the death rate of the poor and elderly. At the same time, Obama continues the unconstitutional and treasonous bailout of Wall Street in the trillions. The bailout continues in the TRILLIONS without the blink of an eye by most members of the administration, house and senate and yet they are tripping all over themselves over the how many pittly BILLIONS to CUT COSTS AND TRIM THE FAT out of MEDICARE.
    Obama's healthcare plan is designed to thin the population especially the poor and elderly who are currently on Medicare.

    ReplyDelete
  111. That plan, unveiled Monday in Des Moines, is a dog's breakfast of bad ideas from Left, Right, and center, topped with an unhealthy amount of wishful thinking. If enacted it would cost Americans dearly — in higher taxes, lost jobs, reduced freedom of choice, and lower quality health care.
    Obama does not put a price tag on his plan, but there is no doubt it will be expensive. Indeed, it will almost certainly be far more expensive than he assumes, since his ideas for cost savings are mostly figments of his imagination. For example, Obama assumes that allowing the federal government to directly negotiate Medicare drug prices will yield substantial savings. But the Congressional Budget Office has said that private insurance plans have already reduced drug prices about as far as they can go, and unless the government is prepared to severely restrict drug formularies, denying seniors access to some drugs, further savings are unlikely.
    Stop giving medical treatment to millions of illegal aliens - I can see emergency help but having babies here and routine care is not our responsibility. This would save billions of dollars. Illegals are the ones clogging emergency rooms because it is their free medical ride. Before we turn our medical care into another failed European model, we should understand why Europeans and Canadians come to the U.S. for life saving care - because it is the best in the world, in spite of its imperfections. Stop turning everything into Socialism - it has never worked and it will never will - the care will be rationed and people will be euthanized or be made to suffer needlessly in this rationing of care scheme. The good news is that the reign of King BHO tis ending. Long live the constitution,
    Turn off the lights,the BO-party is over!

    ReplyDelete
  112. Socialism has been a failure in every Nation where it has been implemented, so why should we be surprised that Obama style Socialism would be any different. It's Obama's intention to destroy the free-enterprise structure that has made America the most prosperous Nation in the history of mankind; and, to replace it with the Socialist structure from his native Kenya. A structure where the elite such as Obama travel and subsist in luxury while the masses wallow in the misery of a system that confiscates the products of their labor so as to acheive Obama's coveted "redistribution of the wealth". Obama is in fact the "Reparator In Chief".

    After the banks and the auto industry, they want to control energy with Cap & Trade and healthcare with this boondoggle. It's all about control and power. To remake the US into a socialist utopia, they must first destroy it as a capitalist beacon.

    Obama has become one of the most arrogant, pompous and self important presidents in recent memory. In the last few days, Obama has lied and lied and lied as have the ads for the DNC on Cap and Tax, Healthcare with no reform, and on cutting the military to make it stronger He is killing free enterprise, killing small business. He is lying to seniors and lying to the middle class about not losing their own payed-for healthcare. Lies. Millions of jobs have been lost. Trillions of debt have been added. No energy resources have been exploited. Green technology is a fraud. This guy cannot be trusted because he lies just to keep his poll numbers up.

    ReplyDelete
  113. Any time a salesman pushes you to quickly buy something very expensive, saying "trust me, it's good for you", alarm bells should go off in our heads. The sounds are deafening over this boondoggle snakeoil salesman Obama. Please write your representatives and say "NO WAY". We want to look at this horse before we buy it.

    On another thought... Truth101, don't think for one minute that I'm going to let that nasty remark you said about me last week go by. I didn't forget it... or you!
    Just because I'm not as NASTY as you are don't think I'm stupid.

    ReplyDelete
  114. Don't know what all your rambling is about James' Muse .. Tried to decipher it, but my head began to hurt . . . You lambasted others for "changing the subject" yet you are all over the place with your "Tyranny" crap etc.
    But I'm not going to get into a pissing fight with you because you are a LIGHTWEIGHT!
    But I am glad to see so many people here taking a stand against the "Great One". This Obamacare plan being foisted upon us will bring more destruction upon our economy. Do some research on how "nationalized" healthcare has worked in Massachusetts. Mayo Medical Center is sueing the state because it has been driven $36 million into the red due to the state-controlled healthcare system (note: for those of you liberals who live in the dark, Mass. is a liberal democrat state controlled by the Kennedy mob). Today's polling shows that of a 16,000+ random nationwide sampling, 77% of American oppose Obama's health(non)care plan, yet the Muck continues to try to ram it down our throats. It is nothing but a narcisstic power play on his part. He cares nothing about our nation. We don't need nationalized healthcare in which we are all are forced into having coverage. We need healthcare cost regulations. If healthcare costs were affordable, those wanting healthcare coverage could afford to buy it on their own and healthcare industry competition would itself be healthy.

    Also,Stop giving medical treatment to millions of illegal aliens - I can see emergency help but having babies here and routine care is not our responsibility. This would save billions of dollars. Illegals are the ones clogging emergency rooms because it is their free medical ride.

    ReplyDelete
  115. Has anyone else noticed that the lefties ( progressive) blogs are not getting much traffic any more!

    ReplyDelete
  116. They got traffic before? I suspect that there are ten people on the left that parrot one another.

    To believe that government control of our lives is a way to go is foolish. Those that back the government in some Orwellian soft takeover are foolish as well.

    People with common sense realize the above fact and don't visit except to try and analyze why someone would want the government in every aspect of their lives. The people that visit these sites are met with personal attacks, grammar comments, and name calling. So, it's no surprise to me that traffic is down on their sites.

    ReplyDelete
  117. Leftie sites go for quality, not quantity.

    Having high numbers for hits is meaningless.

    It's easy to get nutcases to come and rant and contriubte nothing.

    It's difficult to get a thoughtful, informed discussion going.

    ReplyDelete
  118. bluepitbull said...
    "They got traffic before? I suspect that there are ten people on the left that parrot one another."

    That's very true, they get the same handful of buddies slapping each other on their backs for calling Republicans names and throwing insults.
    Time after time Truthie writes about how stupid the "Rightwingers" are, but he is so BIG that he gives 2 rightwing blogers credit for being fair, when he himself is a name-calling LEFTWING nut.
    His site is really boring. I guess without the Conservatives there to bust his chops, he doesn't have anyone to slam .
    Hate is a characteristic of the Leftwingnutcrazies. And without any of us there (anymore) He's getting lonely. So he's coning here with his Girlfriend to do it.
    And by the way, talking about "Girlfriend" what happened to Christopher? Was he caught wearing a skirt that was too short?

    ReplyDelete
  119. Rachel Maddow said...

    Leftie sites go for quality, not quantity.

    Having high numbers for hits is meaningless.

    It's easy to get nutcases to come and rant and contriubte nothing.

    It's difficult to get a thoughtful, informed discussion going.


    THAT is exactly what I'm talking about. You have neither quality nor do you have quantity. And, in ripping others, you open yourselves up to comments.

    ReplyDelete
  120. Welcome to the new America, when and where anyone who disagrees with the Anti American, NeoFascist, Obama agenda and their cut throat "kill and destroy all dissenters" supporters (who time and time again prove they mostly have no minds of their own) destroy on command from the left wing blogs yet another supposed "fellow American" with their endless harassment and downright libel labeling an innocent woman trying to do the right thing, all in their moronic zeal to protect Obama and his race baiting minions and others at all costs


    What “Progressive” and inclusive people we find amongst that hate filled leftists crowds time and time again these crazy days, which leads me to ask when will all the so called "moderate American democrats" realize that they've now been lumped in with the most vitriolic Americans to ever walk our country's soil, simply by virtue of their support for Barack Obama, himself a racist hater in sheep's clothing also being proven more and more each day?
    You people are shameless, and the way you ridicule republicans is absolutely suck! And furthermore, each and every of you can individually kiss this "Proud American’s” behind if you please, as soon as you all get done kissing Obama's You know who you are. You find it fun poking fun ay republicans while slapping each other on the back. . ...Progressive my azz.

    ReplyDelete
  121. Sorry to get off topic Pam, but it seems as if this blog has made a turn to the Left. So if I may, I'd like to throw in a few comments about it..
    I don't get the "hateful comments" thing. Can't Mr. Truth or should I say mr. False even put up ONE blog without ridiculing the "right" ot Bush, or Limhaugh? Is this what Truth/False is all about? Is that all he has?
    Hateful Speech? The words Right wing retard is in almost every blog he does.
    And the progressive blog lady seems to do the same. ...... it contains such shallow, hateful things about the ring and she seems to have a passion about blasting Sarah Palin.
    If Lady progressive had half the brains and a then of the looks that Sarah Palin has she's be alright. Libs sit around mostly with their own kind patting each other on the back because they are all so great and right. They have no idea how to deal with a contrary position to their own. So they just get mad and insultyou. Cons argue with fact. Libs with emotion
    The hateful, whiny liberals that post on those blogs are pathetic.
    Whoever it was that asked the CONSERVATIVES not to post there anymore deserves an award.

    ReplyDelete
  122. Two days ago in a town meeting President Obama said that AARP wouldn’t be endorsing the plan if it was bad for seniors. However, once AARP members became angry, AARP began denying any such endorsement.
    So what gives with that?
    And now American Citizen’s are being asked to report each other?

    What country did I wake up in this morning? Is this still the United States of America, where freedom rings? Is this still a country where you can speak/write what ever is on your mind?

    What possible legitimate reason could the White House have for asking you to report your friends or contacts who might have a “fishy” opinion? What exactly does “fishy” mean in this case? What will they do with this information? Do they plan on acting on these reports?

    Seriously people, you had better wake up and pay attention or someone could be knocking at your door to ask you about an email you forwarded from your inbox.

    What is next with these people?
    Are we still in the USA? It don't look familiar to me..

    ReplyDelete
  123. Great comment Frank.. Let me add my rant.
    As the voices of descent get louder and more numerous Obama attempts to intimidate those who disagree into silence instead of listening to the very people who hired him to lead this country

    How quickly he has forgotten the oath that he took just 71/2 short months ago. Could it be he needs to be reminded of these words?

    “I do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will faithfully execute the office of President of the United States, and will to the best of my ability, preserve, protect and defend the Constitution of the United States.”

    Preserve, protect, and defend the Constitution of the United States.

    Maybe he has forgotten that we the citizens of this country have the right to express our opinions of the policies and programs that his administration (as well as those of his predecessors), enact?

    Or could it be that he had his fingers crossed when he took that oath?
    How stupid do they think we are?
    And yes this Snitch on your neighbor thing..
    Is this Germany, where they expect you to turn in your neighbor, your children, your brother, your wife, your mother. Call the Obama Protective Squadron (Schutzstaffel)and protect the Messiah from the evil mo

    ReplyDelete
  124. One of the greatest things about America is that if you find something wrong with something you can take steps to correct it. You don't have to be a government power broker, you can be an ordinary Joe who happens to have a good idea. You can then make money off of your idea and propel you and your family up the ladder of success.
    All it takes for that to happen is for the government to get out of the way of its people. That is the core principal that has made America great. That is also the core principal that is under attack at this very hour. Over baring government regulations and massive bureaucracies will end all the things that have made America great. Don't let that happen. Stand up and tell them that we don't want this idiotic health care. We can do better. We are taxed enough. And enough is enough. Take your socialism back to Kenya.
    I know the religious zealot of BO believers will never change their ways, but it only takes the other 80% of Americans to turn this nation around and right the wrongs being pursued by congress. No we aren't backed by the likes of George Soros but real Americans have always stepped up when Freedom was in danger.

    I think Patrick henry said it best:

    "I know not what course others may take but for me, give me liberty or give me death."

    We're choosing sides right now and we are ON THE RIGHT SIDE of liberty.

    ReplyDelete
  125. "Dissent is the highest form of patriotism except when it emanates from anyone other than a Democrat or should I say a Progressive.
    Then it is known as a fear mongering, right wing angry mob."

    Have our elected officials completely lost their minds? Apparently, they have.

    ReplyDelete
  126. A Lefty Nut Job wrote on his blog today that Us Republicans have no alternative to Obummers Health plan. And that we other than one person shouldn’t complain if we can not offer an alternative.
    Well let me sat this Mr. False101. No it is NOT our job to come up with an alternative plan and YES, it is the job of the people we elect and their high paid.
    advisers

    But I will take a dab at it.
    The US falls below other countries in the treatment of chronic illness. People use the emergency room as their only form of healthcare. This raises the cost of healthcare for everyone. The costs are distributed over the people that do pay by higher costs of services and health insurance rates. Lack of access to primary care causes: • Use of emergency rooms for non emergency healthcare such as urinary tract infections, minor injuries and upper respiratory infections • Chronic conditions such as hypertension, high cholesterol, diabetes, heart disease, arthritis related conditions and asthma do not get treated • Lack of treatment leads to health situations with much higher costs • Many persons needing treatment, when treated, cannot pay and the costs are then passed on to persons, insurance companies and the government as increased costs • Hospitals bear the burden of treating people which do not need to be in the hospital or might not have needed to be there if they had received ongoing primary care • Chronic health conditions do not receive sufficient care or sporadic care • The healthcare system becomes clogged with ILLEGAL ALIENSI using them for things like a common cold.. Healthcare costs can be brought under control by making primary care accessible to everyone and encourage people to use it. We need to educate people so they feel comfortable seeing their primary care physician. We need to make emergency rooms for real emergencies. We need to have more primary care physicians, physician assistants and nurse practitioners. This also means teaching people MAINLY THOSE ILLEGAL ALIENS new 21st century ways to relate to our new healthcare system AND THE USE OF emergency rooms for non emergencies.
    Or GET them out of the country entirely.

    ReplyDelete
  127. Write, write, write to your elected officials in Washington!

    Call them everyday!

    Flood their e-mail boxes.

    Tell all your sensible friends to do the same thing!

    Make them understand that they represent US, not their special interest funders!

    Force them to kill cap and trade, kill any health care bill with a public option, kill any health care bill without tort reform, kill any health care bill that benefits special interests, kill any health care bill that is LONGER THAN 100 pages!

    And if they dare succumb to Obama's arrogant, criminal, Chicago INTIMIDATION (he intimidates them just like he is trying to intimidate us)and ram it through DESPITE what the citizens of this country demand, then VOTE THEM OUT in 2010, regain control of the country, impeach the sorry bastard, and send him back to Kenya!

    Don't just come here and rant - write them, call them, e-mail them. (Especially write and call). They need a lot of support from us to Buck Ofama b/c he is criminally pressuring them to bend to his socialist will.

    ReplyDelete
  128. Right. I'm the lightweight, Frank, when you can't follow our conversation. Tyranny, btw, was what "I'm here to say it" was screaming about...

    Blue, you are using moral equivalency again. "The LEFT did worse, so its okay that the RIGHT screams and throws a temper tantrum..."

    In a discussion, when one is trying to debate healthcare reform, and someone immediately screams "TYRANNY!" or "SOCIALISM" or whatever nonsense they are spouting off, they lose ALL CREDENCE. So yeah, more power to them. But now no one will listen to them. At all. IHTSI may have a good point in there somewhere. But in a discussion about healthcare, most people are going to disregard someone's opinion who can't rise above ranting about how much they hate Obama/Democrats/whatever else they find to hate.

    Just like when the left couldn't rise above "HITLER!" or "FASCISM" in order to express their displeasure about something. When someone begins to shout about these sorts of things, they lose credence.

    ReplyDelete
  129. Reverend: The tenth amendment says the Federal Government only can do what the Constitution says it can do.

    The constitution gives Congress the authority to write laws, and the president to sign them into law.

    Nothing you ranted about is against the constitution.

    ReplyDelete
  130. Yes, the lefties blame Rush and the other talk shows for Obmas decline.. While the president and his top aides are courting members through phone calls, cocktail parties, West Wing sit-downs and even a politically mixed Super Bowl party, liberal groups are dispensing with the niceties and seeking to drive a wedge between Republicans and one of the right’s most influential leaders, his numbers are falling like a hose of cards. The Prof Gates issue, 66 percent of the American public now believe that their Taxes are going to go up, regardless of what Øbama says.. And yes the Health care issue is this going to be the last straw on the camels back? All these issues are getting the disapproval of the American public.
    Yet the Liberal bloggers seem to blame people like Rush Limbaugh for his decline.
    This isn't about Rush Limbaugh, it's about what type of America you want. Do you want a government nanny state who offers up a titty to suckle upon when ever you need nurturing? Then side with Øbama and his socialist minions in the senate. If you don't want big government to rule your every step through life and rob you in the process then you better start speaking out, because if you don't these socialist Nazis are gonna completely destroy this country and turn it into the first undeveloped nation in the world.
    I am with Rush because he only has the power to entertain us, whereas Øbama has the power to ruin us. And it looks like he is well on his way. But that is okay because the more damage he does, the easier it will be in the mid term elections to clean house, as the label of Democrat will be synonymous with failure, just as it always has been

    ReplyDelete
  131. There is no moral equivalency in any of my comments here, James. You may want to see them, but they don't exist.

    They aren't throwing temper tantrums, so scrap that argument. They want answers. They aren't painting their hands red and shoving them in anyone's face and screaming. They aren't a bunch of dope smoking hippies from Berkeley hanging out in the Texas heat reliving Woodstock.

    The are, however, concerned citizens with honest concerns and this isn't a partisan battle. There are people on all sides concerned.

    I don't care how angry these libs get. I don't care that many are talking of stopping their blogs, I hope they do.

    There is plenty wrong with the healthcare proposal that was drafted in the house and the senate and reps have a choice: They can continue to lie or they can be displaced by new, fresh people. As that goes, I hope it happens.

    ReplyDelete
  132. Blue, you said "I could site examples from not-so-far in our blogging past where many of these lefties have used tactics much worse"...moral equivalency.

    Being angry about a healthcare bill is understandable, but when we are talking about that and Sergeant York comes in and starts ranting about some list of grievances about Obama and the Democrats, and then IHTSI joins in with his own list, that's a temper tantrum. When, in a discussion about one subject, you can only talk about how much you hate the president, that is a temper tantrum, and as I said, just makes the rest of us look like looney tunes, too.

    ReplyDelete
  133. Case in point: The "Truth 102" above, ranting about "socialist Nazis" and other Bull. That is nothing but a temper tantrum that isn't helpful to the discussion, and again, makes the rest of us look crazy if we say we're Republicans, too.

    ReplyDelete
  134. No, you're wrong. For it to be a true moral equivalency, I would have to make a one on one comparison with what dems have done in the past.

    What is happening at these townhall meetings is nothing compared to what dems have done. You're a master of moral equivalency. We can go to your site anytime and see it, so, easy.

    And it still doesn't get to the root of the problem; and that's that people don't want this bill.

    You might also want to consider switching parties.

    ReplyDelete
  135. Hey James, you can say what you want to it don't make a hill of beans to me. Your BS don’t pass the smell test.
    But it is what it is! This is a 1100 page document that almost no one has read fully just like the Stimulus bill that was past. This bill will force every one to get health coverage. For those that chose not to it will fine you for not having coverage and enroll you in a plan of the government’s choice. Fines are over $1000 per individual and probably close to $4000 per family. It will be deducted from your pay ever month like Income tax. So you pay check just go even smaller.

    No more free choice this is strait up Socialism bordering Communism. If I choose to pay cash for my medical I should have the right to do so not have the government tell me I have to have there plan.
    Are we going to squander our future on someone who has a personal agenda? Ask yourself what is the real interest?

    And if you don't like my bringing in unrelated topics that's too freaken bad..
    Hers some more for you.. You can call it a temper tantrum or whatever else you want to...
    I like to be very vocal about my strong opposition and intentions to vote against anyone who supports Obama’s irresponsible, extremist socialized policies. Fact is, Fox News had him pegged from the get-go. This guy is a radical leftist / Marxist / socialist extremist with a personal agenda that he puts before the best interest of our nation. This was blatant when he spoke in favor of Prof H.L. Gates, denouncing the Boston police force and implying racism! Obama made this a racist issue. Gates behaved immaturely and disrespectfully toward the police. Obama made his “agenda” statement without knowing the facts, by his own admission! Regardless of how much he knew, a mature, responsible President does not provide public opinion or take sides in ANY legal issue. He’s our commander-in-chief, but clearly not fit for his current “pay-grade”! A Community Organizer has no more skills than a kindergarten teacher. Fact is, that’s unfair to a pre-school teacher, most of whom have far more common sense, diplomacy, patience and maturity than Obama. Most importantly, they do not have a personal agenda which overrides their duties as a teacher and leader! We need to get this Bozo, Pelosi, Frank, Dodd and his other self-serving minions out of office ASAP.

    Thanks for lending me your ear.

    You can say what you want to now.

    ReplyDelete
  136. Sarge: I’m at work, so I don’t have a lot of time.

    I’m a VERY VOCAL person myself and when I’m PASSIONATE about something my voice raises a little higher in volume so I get ACCUSED of yelling, which ticks me off something fierce. I’m not really yelling, I’m just PASSIONATE. BUT....there is NOTHING more annoying TO ME than to have someone tell me to STOP yelling!

    How about this...PAY ATTENTION AND I WOULDN’T HAVE TO RAISE MY VOICE!!

    ReplyDelete
  137. Blue: Moral equivalance is anytime someone excuses their behavior by saying it isn't as bad as the "other side."

    Also, it has been quite awhile since I've used the moral equivalancy argument on my blog.

    I wasn't talking about town halls; I'm talking about here. I haven't been to the town halls yet to see for myself what is going on. But what I am seeing here is what I am talking about. See the Sergeants rant above. He has lost all credence, because he is being ridiculous in his rant and ad hominem attacks..."extremism", "nazism", socialism, blah blah blah. He comes across as a sore loser, saying that somehow only Republicans are fit to run the government. Such claims lie in partisan ignorance.

    Also, Blue, why the personal attacks here? You insult me and my blog. As for switching parties, I won't be doing that. I'm also not going to be defending my Republican credentials here, on this site, so enough with that. I'm just as Republican as you are, sir.

    ReplyDelete
  138. Pam: I think you are right in that. I think there is a lot to be angry about, and a lot that needs to be talked about at these town halls.

    Where I'm seeing problems is when people begin talking about their issues regarding healthcare, and others (on the blogosphere and in the real world) denigrate to anti-obama/anti-democrats rants and use these forums to air any and all unrelated grievances they have.

    ReplyDelete
  139. Great comment Sarge, that was just about the best rant I ever read, you said exactly what many of us are thinking.

    Pam, the Sarge is doing just fine, Yes, he is very PASSIONATE and yes, he raises his voice a little. But sometimes that's what it takes to get your point across.
    And to those sick little peons that think Obama’s is doing you a justice. I will encourage you to really read this bill. Read it carefully. Don’t rely on what Obama tells you.
    My government spending MY money to push a plan that the majority don't support and frankly they don't seem to be able to defend. Obama took to the airwaves a few weeks ago to "explain" the healthcare issue and frankly came up very short. Why did he fail so miserably? He had all the time in the world having orchestrated the presser to ask the questions he wanted to answer and still he bombed.

    Now at the lastest town hall meeting he uses a little girl to read off a piece of paper how mean and horrible those signs are out in front. Come to find out he knew that little girl and her mother and so they were a plant. This is why things are going south for this administration. The entire debate is now falling into the cesspole and whatever comes out will stink to high heaven.

    Is this the "change"

    ReplyDelete
  140. You want health insurance? GET A JOB and stop sucking on Uncle Sam.
    James if you have a problem with that, just let me know, and I'll retract it for you. LOL

    ReplyDelete
  141. Blue Line: I agree, Sarge is doing great. I welcome him here as a new follower! I was just pointing out that he and I are similar in that we are passionate and if this were a video blog it would probably be LOUD! But hey, sometimes you’ll have that when people feel strongly on issues close to their heart!

    I have a lot of catching up to do when I get home from work! Bare with me!

    ReplyDelete
  142. James' Muse said...

    Pam: I think you are right in that. I think there is a lot to be angry about, and a lot that needs to be talked about at these town halls.

    Where I'm seeing problems is when people begin talking about their issues regarding healthcare, and others (on the blogosphere and in the real world) denigrate to anti-obama/anti-democrats rants and use these forums to air any and all unrelated grievances they have.


    Maybe you should start your own ENEMIES LIST.

    ReplyDelete
  143. Thin Blue Line: What are you talking about?

    ReplyDelete
  144. James: But the anger is understandable, yes? Aren’t you mad, too? The health care bill is just another form of spending, so when we think of it we then remember the Stimulus and the Omnibus and then we get angrier. Then we remember when Obama said he wouldn’t raise taxes and we know that’s impossible if they pass this bill and we get even angrier. In short, it’s not JUST about health care, although that’s the most current bill on the table at this time, it’s about everything that has accumulated and people are exploding.

    ReplyDelete
  145. James' Muse said...
    "Thin Blue Line: What are you talking about?"

    What am I talking about?
    You seem to have a problem with what everyone says.
    So start your own Enemies List!
    You also have a problem interpreting other peoples posts.

    Why not stop getting pissed at the world?
    If I remember you also had a problem with what Im Here To Say It said....

    I think that you fit in better with Truth and Shaw.
    Wow, that's really going to hit a sore spot. Or maybe not?

    ReplyDelete
  146. Regarding Obam's plan I did a blog on this that basically said:

    When a product such as this Health care plan fails you repackage it, redefine it and resale it. Or, get the hint we are not interested in what you are trying to cram down our throat and stipulate there isn't anything you do well which includes the appointing 32 new czars. I get so sick of this continued soap opera saga....A fifth grader could do a better job. Obama is getting taught a painful lesson. I guess this is what happens when America elects a armature socialist to go around the world apologizing for America.
    It’s also very hard to fight someone who compares the running of health care to the running of the post office..

    ReplyDelete
  147. Pam: Yes, that is true. And yes, I've been angry at the bailouts/stimuluses, etc.

    But I'm also angry at my fellow Republicans for not doing anything about it, except rant and rave about "socialism" or "birth certificates" or other nonsense. I'm also angry that Republicans have such a short memory; Bush and the Republican congress ran up a huge debt, too, and started this bailout nonsense. Yet seem only able to blame the Democrats.

    We need to move beyond that. Yes, bring up related grievances. But when someone says, "let's talk about healthcare" it is counterproductive to start shouting about socialism, fascism, or other tirades. People in power stop listening when people can do nothing but shout about "tyranny." Instead of yelling about those things, why not try to talk/yell about your problems with the issue at hand, about how it feels like another stimulus, another bailout, and you don't think it will work.

    Pam, you do a great job of this. But others on here, when asked about it, will only paste rants about how much they hate Obama. Its ridiculous, and gets us nowhere. If the Republican/conservative side can't rise above ranting about how much they hate Obama, no one will listen. And then the bill will get passed, because the dems have a majority.

    ReplyDelete
  148. Wow Pam this has really become a big debate hasn't it.

    Well let me add my 2 cents if I may.
    At best, Obama's health care plan will be the same as the Canadian/British plans: at worst it could make those plans considerably seem ideal. Nobody knows for sure, too much retoric and not enough fact since the bills are largely unread! In Canada, many conditions recieve little or late treatment due to defacto rationing. The limitations on the elderly are particularly disturbing since they allow many to suffer in later life. Medicine should not only cure or ameliorate disease but most importantly should reduce suffering. Cancer patients can wait 2 or 3 months for treatment here in fear, discomfort or pain. I am sure you understand suffering due to personal experience. Why not stop your win-lose political preoccupation and fight for a plan that provides care for the 50 million uninsured without requiring the necessity of rationing that invariably must be a requirement of a single payer, government operated system.
    Why would anyone promote a universal healthcare system when our country is on the brink of financial collapse? Sometimes you just can't seem to see the forest for the trees. We are going to attempt to pay for this program by taxing current employer based health plans, Medicare cuts, and of course higher taxes on the rich. Any halfway intelligent person knows that won't cut the mustard. After a few more knee busting meetings with Obama and Emanuel they may reverse course. Knowing we can't pay for this gigantic bureaucratic nightmare is not even the worst part. We will all experience less care than we have now. Many of us are appalled that we will be forced to pay for Undocumented folks health care while they flood in across our borders and pour into our airports. Many of those who don't want health care (typically the young) will be very angry at the fines (8%? of income).
    The concept of "free care for all" is beyond deeply flawed; it is a delusion.

    All those people at town hall meetings have worked hard all their lives in their respective jobs, paid for care when they could. The 80% of Americans not unemployed or on assistance are speaking with a single voice about the need for fairness and logical problem solving, and the avoidance of trying to make delusions real. It’s typical of a socialistic type of government.
    The stupid Liberals who call the rest of us uninformed proletariat’s need to look in the mirror!!
    1. The 20-30 years old who think that they are invincible and don't need insurance.
    2. The illegal aliens and their families that jam up our hospitals emergency rooms.
    3. Senior citizens who have medicare.
    4. Poor citizens who have medicaid.
    5. Children who are cover by a separate plan. (I don't remember what its called)
    6. Citizens that are between jobs. (Yes even in this economy)
    So if you pull out all of the above the numbers magically drop!!!
    Wise up people. No one gets anything for nothing.. Your going to pay for it one way or another, and you may pay for it with your freedoms.

    ReplyDelete
  149. Well James, what have YOU done?
    You have been criticizing everyone else. You tell us what you have done..
    And stop criticizing as you say "your fellow republicans"

    ReplyDelete
  150. Actually, Me myself and I, I thought you were right on, because you actually talked about your frustration with the subject at hand.

    As for criticizing fellow republicans, if we won't call our own people on their bull, who will? The other side will criticize Republicans for anything, that's a given. But when someone on your own side calls you on your crap, you should probably listen.

    A better example: I'll take criticism from my best friend before I would from someone who I know is against me anyway.

    ReplyDelete
  151. And as for what I've done, I'm not sure what you mean. What have I done about healthcare? I'm trying to read the bill so I can form my own opinion. But its over 1,000 pages long, and it'll take awhile to read it.

    ReplyDelete
  152. I thought it funny that the one rightie, I forgot which one, had the longest rant he ever ranted complaining about the long health care bill.

    And just to correct without sounding elitist to the Rightie that said I called righties "right wing retards." My signature catch phrase is "deluded right wing fool." The mentally handicapped deserve more respect than to be lumped in with a few of the deluded right wing fools I've had dealings with.

    ReplyDelete
  153. Pamela, Jennifer, I've started compiling a list of your suggestions. Let's make a viable Republican alternative to this, since our representatives won't.

    ReplyDelete
  154. No personal attacks, but 'right wing retards' is OK?

    Take it you aren't getting enough attention over at truth shall rule so you gotta come here and stir the pot.

    ReplyDelete
  155. When did I call you or anyone else that BPB? Find it and I'll apologise. You don't find it and I expect an apology from you.

    ReplyDelete
  156. You can kiss it before you get an apology from me. I did read your statement wrong, but that's only because it's no less than I would expect from you.

    You say plenty enough offensive stuff that I shouldn't ever have to apologize to you.

    ReplyDelete
  157. bluepitbull said...

    You can kiss it before you get an apology from me. I did read your statement wrong, but that's only because it's no less than I would expect from you.

    You say plenty enough offensive stuff that I shouldn't ever have to apologize to you.



    Amen to that!!

    ReplyDelete
  158. Your admitting you were wrong is an acceptable apology Bluepitbull. Now have a nice day kind sir.

    ReplyDelete
  159. Why are you guys offended by the truth?

    ReplyDelete
  160. There is truth, and then there is your interpretation of the truth which is always distorted and misrepresented.

    I'm getting tired of seeing you malcontents unhappy even when you're in charge of the country. You still find it in your heart to bash the opposition, and why? Because you don't really believe in what you say you stand for. But, it's OK, keep saying foolish things just like our president.

    ReplyDelete
  161. As I have watched the discussion on health care reform I am totally amazed that the American people cannot see the real facts.

    The only reason that health care costs have gone through the roof is the hundreds of thousands of attorneys that only specialize in malpractice suits. (There by becoming rich on the backs of every American in the form of higher health care costs.)
    When you go to a doctor or hospital, you are going to seek the help of a better trained human being hoping they can help you.
    They are not a GOD therefore they cannot fix everything perfectly. If you expect this you will have to wait for the resurrection.

    The attorneys tell you if the service is not perfect (GOD LIKE)then you must sue. The American people have bought into this belief and the juries go along with the belief.

    The Doctors, Hospitals and Insurance companies must charge enough to cover their costs of your service, Immense malpractice insurance and still feed their families.

    This country was founded on self reliance and was built to the greatest Nation on Earth by people that put everything have on the line every day to supply people with jobs and the others choose to supply health care. The profit made on a persons services is what has made this country great.

    Obama and his crew in the mobocracy of DC are running on a fast track to total Socialism. To make sure as many people as possible follow them they are preaching that a company that makes a profit is evil and Unamerican. Tax the rich but not them they are the elite.

    I do not feel we have until 2010 to start to make changes. We must start with recall elections in every state and they should be directed toward every congress person that has held office starting with Jimmy Carter’s administration. With a recall and firing of the congress people we may also be able to stop the Billions of dollars that the tax payers will pay for their retirements until their death. This burden is totally unacceptable when we fire them.

    They must be required to use government health care just like everyone else when they are in the private sector.

    If we do not start to act now and with decisive action it will be to late.


    This is NOT health”care” - it’s more GOVERNMENT CONTROL!

    In my opinion, the strategy is to bankrupt the country, meaning the government will have further “justification” to implement higher taxes for EVERYONE and more government “programs”.

    As more and more of the population becomes dependent on the government for everyday needs, the government has the ability to break the will of the people.

    Health”care” is one of the best ways to control the masses.

    ReplyDelete
  162. You are tired of Lefties like me exposing you for the parrot of right wing talking points you are Bluepitbull. You need to pull pull your ostrich like head out of the sands of Redstate nonsense you bury it in for most of your day. Only to pull it out long enough to type some foolishness which gets quickly refuted, but also gets you a few cyber high fives from your army of fellow deluded right wing fools.

    But hey, we like a pat on the back now and then. I don't begrudge you that.

    ReplyDelete
  163. In my humble opinionAugust 14, 2009 at 8:03 AM

    Over the last few weeks I have been totally amazed at some of the crap posted in these Forums.
    I have a thick skin and would never complain no matter what anyone threw at me. But I have one thing to sat to that Lame TRUTH 101 ....You SHOULD Stick That Where The Sun Don't Shine.

    ReplyDelete
  164. Say what you want. I wasn't looking for any 'high fives' as you say.

    I do know, however, that you are a walking , talking cry for attention with some of the crap you write.

    That said, let's get back on subject.

    ReplyDelete
  165. The asinine person that calls himself Truth101 said...Only to pull it out long enough to type some foolishness which gets quickly refuted, but also gets you a few cyber high fives from your army of fellow deluded right wing fools.



    So this hero of the modern day liberal mind set who is having a bad day not only attacks Bluepitbull, but all of the conservative American citizens that happen to agree with his political philosophy. How cool is that! That was really great (sarcastic) . But coming from a
    Who would do absolutely ANYTHING and EVERYTHING to discredit the truth, whatever he says is totally meaningless.

    Like Nancy Pelosi and Harry Reid they say things that are so damn ridiculously asinine it’s a joke. I don’t care what he or she thinks. But I DO care that they are a cog in a massive propaganda machine out to assist the left in implementing a Statist and frankly fascist agenda. Then he makes those outlandish accusations to defend his asinine posts and continues spewing his hatred. I doubt if anyone takes his madness seriously, but for him to call all republicans the things he does makes me see red. The Obama express has suddenly become a local and will soon come to a swift halt and you are starting to see it right now. The fact is that everyone in YOUR camp was just dumb enough that they didn't think this could happen ... So go peddle your liberal crap on Huffington’s blog.. Good people like Bluepitbull don’t deserve your whipping.
    Well, liberals and Truth101, Dissent WAS the highest form of patriotism when George Bush was in office, now it’s suddenly become a form of treason! This guy really needs to learn how to think about what he says before he says it. That's assuming he knows how to think in the first place. I have had enough of the lies, misdirections and evil that’s out there we don’t need anymore from the likes of a MORON American Hater like you.

    And by the way, If it hadn't been for George Bush, the man you hate so much, your dumb ass would have been blown to crap by now.
    And anyone one that even visits your IGNORANT Anti American Anti White blog other than the IGNORANT Anti American Anti White Liberals are crazy.
    It's a Liberal Cesspool, that should be filled in with garbage. A mix of crap and lies that never fails to amuse.

    ReplyDelete
  166. Let's face it people.
    There is a war, in progress, in cyberspace, especially in the blogosphere between the political left and the political right. This is a war, which will last well into the future. The Right wants to participate in the blogosphere, and the Left wants to control it.

    I support staying away from the liberal bloggers blogs that disrespect republicans.
    I’m no shrink, but I believe a shrink would say this is a manifestation of the self-hate and impotency of the political left.
    If you would read the post that was made here by Truth101 and the reply from SeenTheLight, you will see exactly what I mean.
    The two sides will never and can never get along.
    Case in point, Truth101 thinks that Pittbull is his whipping boy and that is very obvious. Well folks it's time for US republican to let him know that this is not acceptable.

    ReplyDelete
  167. Oh come on, let's talk about healthcare instead of beating on the weak.

    He always changes subject when he can't answer a question, I don't care too much about that.

    The left doesn't want tort reform, they don't want illegal aliens rounded up and shipped home, they don't want all Americans to pay taxes to support their spending habits. What they do want is over the top social waste. So far, none of the social programs in place work worth a damn. Even the postal service is a failure.

    LBJ's Great Society is an abject failure, Social Security and anything social that FDR touched was a failure. I want to know who is going to pay for all of this spending besides me and some of you. It certainly ain't the people who will benefit the most from it.

    There may not be death panels in the bill yet, but look at the example in Oregon and assure yourself there will be rationing and over spending. Nothing the government touches succeeds. Even the military has huge over spending due to a monopoly in the logistics side of the house.

    Given the amount of compensation that doctors get currently from Medicaid, what's going to happen with nationalized healthcare? What incentive to doctors have to be doctors when they get nothing in compensation? I can assure you that short of either a government run medical corps (gag) or a dictatorship, many of these doctors will leave their loved profession and pursue other venues.

    There will certainly be fewer students going into medicine if this happens as well.

    Things to think about.

    Meanwhile the left is trying to go off subject and if you don't believe me, look at how truth tried to hijack the discussion, or go to Shaw's site and look at the Bush bashing still going on. they don't have solutions, only complaints. That's why homey ain't playin' on this one.

    ReplyDelete
  168. Pittbull has said:
    Meanwhile the left is trying to go off subject and if you don't believe me, look at how truth tried to hijack the discussion, or go to Shaw's site and look at the Bush bashing still going on. they don't have solutions, only complaints. That's why homey ain't playin' on this one..


    Well Pittbull, thats what they do, you of all people should know that.
    If they don't change the topic, they resort to their name calling.

    Richard Nixon is still turning over in his grave.

    ReplyDelete
  169. This comment has been removed by the author.

    ReplyDelete
  170. Listen Truthie#000

    Don’t come here and regurgitate waste you learned from some other blogger (who daily reveals HERSELF for the idiot she is with the dumb subjects along with the insulting comments on her blog) and imagine that I won’t insult you and then call me rude when I do.
    You repukes are the lowest of the low. Your language on this site alone shows how full of hate you are. You can only hate in others that which you hate on yourself. Do some soul searching and come to terms with your own self loathing. Trpical Liberal .

    ReplyDelete
  171. a war against liberty is a war against freedom. Freedom is what the evil doers are fighting against, and so are we.

    You have to have a willingness to make that decision going forward with your eyes open. If you don't, the terrorists win. Obama's a socialist, he's trying to institutionalize socialism.

    Freedom isn't free. That means you have to pay for it. They don't just give it to you.

    What Obama's trying to do now is destroy the country.

    ReplyDelete
  172. Guess that's it. They've gone back to wikipedia to resarch their counterpoints.

    ReplyDelete
  173. If I remember correctly Bluepitbull, our side won WWII under FDR's leadership. Millions of people each day thank God for FDR and Social Security. Millions thank God for LBJ and Medicare. It is your Republican Party that decided to borrow trillions to support it's spending habits. Only now that it is out of power does it feel a need to preach fiscal responsibility.

    And so all my right leaning friends here know, Truth 101 is pro tort reform. Pro balancing our budget through sacrifice by all of us. Not just the wealthy. We all had a hand in it. We all need to be a part of fixing it. I am also pro 2nd Amendment. Pro not standing in the way of our only real ally in the Middle East, Israel, defending herself.

    Try reading what I've posted instead of reading what intellectually blind fools like Bluepitbull tell you I wrote for a change.

    ReplyDelete
  174. Truth, outside of seeing FDR as a leader in WWII, he also stayed neutral and allowed the Japanese and the Germans to build and stood by with Chamberlain during the anexation of the Sudatenland.

    The only reason he entered the war was to get re-elected.

    Millions thank God for medicare? Really?

    Don't try to change the subject. HEALTHCARE

    And you can say what you want about your subject, but if you really stood up for anything, you wouldn't be such an ass. Never portend to tell me what to speak of. Your an offensive ass that needs to erase your site. you hold no relevance to any discussion and only serve as a person to throw the conversation in different directions. Go away.

    ReplyDelete
  175. TRUTH 101 said...
    I don't have much sympathy with the protesters, at least the ones that are on TV Carl. Thya all are programed to say the same things. They all say socialism and return following the Constitution. It was frsh when Ron Paul reminded us to do that. It's turned into a meaningless talking point. This argument has been going on for 200 years. The expanding of the federal government. What other entity could establish a central bank. See to the defense of the Nation. Provide the regulation and enforcement necessary to keep society civil.


    That's really what you have to say.

    ReplyDelete
  176. TRUTH 101 said...
    If I remember correctly Bluepitbull, our side won WWII under FDR's leadership. Millions of people each day thank God for FDR and Social Security. Millions thank God for LBJ and Medicare."

    Ah but that was the Good Ole Days'

    Yes, those were the day my Friend, I thought they'd never end".. But they did..and now we don't have FDR and the Democratic party are we KNEW it!
    We NOW have the Liberal party and the the PROGRESSIVE Party and we have the likes of Barrack Hussein Obama.. And putzes like Nancy Palusi and Harry Stone face Reid, and the Swimmer, and all the other azz hole in the Senate
    Big difference. Very big difference.

    ReplyDelete
  177. When did Medicare cease to be a part of the health care system Bluepitbull? And it was you that brought up FDR and LBJ my friend.

    I'm sorry you suffer a severe case of "logic0phobia BPB. You have a good health insurance plan. I bet it covers mental health issues. Look into it Brother.

    ReplyDelete
  178. The lying left and their hypocritical worthlessness to society and that includeds YOU Truth101! . They are the only ones to bring up race, fear, violence, and they wouldn’t survive without stirring up distention and mistrust. They have set back blacks in America in a diabolical way that enslaves them to an entitlement system that makes them completely dependent on a government hand out.

    ReplyDelete
  179. The funny thing is that I answered everything and again I have to put up with your insults, truth.

    The bottom line: Everything the government touches fails. The only thing that makes medicaid worth a crap is private insurance options.

    Yes I brought them up, and I answered you, but instead you have to talk of mental health. I think I'm done with this post.

    ReplyDelete
  180. With all love, due respect, and Christian compassion Truth101, you are a MORON
    How delusional can you be? The rest of the world comes to the United States to get high quality healthcare when their own socialist healthcare systems fail them.

    If you love this Socialistic Crap so much You and Shaw can go to Cuba anytime you want to I hear Cuba is taking emigrants.
    If you hate this country so much Truthie, leave. We won’t miss you at all! Don’t let the door slam on your Liberal behinds on your way out.
    PACK UP YOUR DAMN BAGS, GIVE UP YOUR CITIZENSHIP & GET
    THE HELL OUT OF MY BEAUTIFUL COUNTRY!! It's as Simple as that, if you hate here so damn much you
    friggin thing, then why don’t you move to a third-world country or better yet, move to
    either Iran, North Korea, Cuba, Venezula, Syria, etc., and live under a dictatorship that you seem to love.

    ReplyDelete
  181. We were warned during the primaries and the general election and far too many people ignored all those warning signs, or they wouldn't have voted for him!!

    We're stuck with Sotomayor, let's hope that's the last thing he does that we get stuck with!! I"m keeping my fingers crossed - even though he's acting as I expected.

    He did not disappoint me. I expected him to suck. And he sucks.
    - I hope his agenda fails!!

    ReplyDelete
  182. So you DIDN'T LIKE BUSH monitoring some" phone calls from the US to Syria?

    How you gonna like Obama in YOUR BANK ACCOUNT, IN YOUR ORGANS, in YOUR GAS TANK, in your 401K, and at YOUR ELECTRIC METER?
    Oh and you also want to GIVE up the BUSH TAX CUTS, that 5 tax increase, ON ITS WAY!
    I wasn't a big fan of Bush either, but compared to this guy, I'd take Bush back in a second.
    I was frightened he would get elected and when he did I knew I would then find out what his agenda was. We didn't have to wait long. Within about 3 days we all knew it.
    AND, This plan to force all Americans to buy over-priced, politically created health insurance, create an economically unsustainable government-run insurance plan, and impose economy-crushing taxes. More than 88 million Americans could LOSE their private, employer-based coverage. Yearly premiums for Americans with private coverage could jump as much as $460 per person as a result of more cost-shifting. Even doctors stand to lose thousands of dollars of income under the legislation. Annual physician net income is estimated to drop by 6.3 percent or $13.4 billion (coming in at an average $18,900 per physician) when compared with current trends.

    This is OUTRAGEOUS, and YOU must stop it. Please, do the RIGHT thing -- REJECT H.R. 3200, " America's Affordable Health Choices Act of 2009," or any other attempt to force socialized health care or government-mandated health insurance on Americans. Thank you.

    ReplyDelete
  183. Let me ask YOU this. If you are already pessimistic about the government and are questioning the health care bill, and love America as I do than why in the heck would you go to a web-site that is full of anti American slander and Liberal BS and self hating Americans, people who are as opposed to the things we love as Hugo Chavez and Fidel Castro are! Do these people possess an ounce of common sense? NO!

    ReplyDelete
  184. OK I Will Take Bluepitbull's Abvice

    And NEVER post on either Shaw's or Truth101's blogs again.
    I promise.
    Liberals claim to be peace loving individuals, but boy, don't contradict with their bleeding-heart liberal ways or you will suffer the wrath. The sniveling cowards they are.
    The whole world is screaming at what Obama is doing and these bloggers are supporting it.
    Go figure.

    ReplyDelete
  185. Pamela D. Hart said... Let me ask this ...why in the heck would you go to a web-site that is created and run by the very people who wrote the bill...?

    First of all, nobody in the WH wrote the bill. Congress is responsible for that. Secondly, maybe you'd be willing to hear what they have to say because you've decided you're willing to give them a chance to present their case. Or because you're an intelligent person who doesn't make up her mind before hearing both sides of the argument? Unless you've decided to be willfully ignorant, I don't understand why you'd at least not want to know what it is they had to say before making up your mind.

    Right Is Right said... I just watch that STACKED audience Town Hall meeting ... it was only a platform for Obama to give his BS speech. The people of America want their country back. It's time to stop trying to keep up with the Democrats by acting just like them and get back to their conservative values and ethics. ...[or] they will pay the price at the polls.

    I really really am praying that you are right. After the insanely ridiculous lies the Republicans have been spreading about the proposed health care legislation (see the posts of Sergeant York and "Billy the magic kid") I would LOVE it if the end result would be that the Democrats pick up additional congressional seats in 2010.

    Post election the Republican base continues to shrink. Recently ejected from the party are the not-morally bankrupt smart conservatives - the people you'd call RINOs (they've been been trying to get rid of these people for the past 8 years, but there are still a few left), and non-racists - which includes people who were sickened by how Sonya Sotomayor was smeared (they had been trying to capture some Latino votes during the past 8 years, but that effort has clearly ended).

    Who you have left are the morally bankrupt rich a-holes of average/above average intelligence, racists who can't believe that a black man really was elected president, and stupid people who can be conned into voting against their own best interests (they're worried about Obama's "death panels").

    Keep it up and I don't know how you couldn't lose seats in the next election. It isn't all good news though -- in the meantime Democrats are still trying to compromise with Republicans on healthcare legislation. Which is a huge mistake. What we could end up with is a crap bill for which the Democrats will be blamed. That could help the Republicans in the next election. So, despite the Republicans apparent post-election suicide attempts, I'm still worried.

    BTW, it isn't my intention with this post to call Pamela stupid, although I suppose that is what I did. Let's just say that, from MY point of view, this kind of thinking is stupid (you probably feel the same way about liberals). I just don't understand why anyone would vote against their own best interests, or why an average middle class american be in favor of allowing big health and big pharma to continue ripping them off, or why anyone would believe in ridiculous lies like "death panels" (after lying about "death panels", why wasn't the rest of what Sarah Palin and Charles Grassley said drowned out by laughter??).

    ReplyDelete
  186. Shaw Kenawe said... This is the problem, my friends. I presented a fact ... This caused Sgt. York to get angry with me. Sgt. York couldn't refute what I wrote...

    Yes, I noticed that too. He never addressed any of your points. He only responded with disguised personal attacks (disguised in that he was accusing you of thinking you were better than him).

    Sergeant York said... Did you see that SIDE SHOW that Obama put on today? ...if anyone thinks that SHOW wasn’t staged, you were born yesterday! That place was packed with his supporters.

    The town hall was not staged or packed with his supporters. You're thinking about the last president. He's the guy who pre-screened entrants into his town halls. I was not born yesterday, btw.

    TRUTH 101 said... Incredible. Of all the right leaning bloggers, only two, Pamela and Jennifer, offered any alternatives to the health insurance plan being bandied about. NONE of the others did.

    I'm not a right-leaning blogger, but I've got an alternative to suggest: SINGLE PAYER. This is where President Obama should have started. Instead he took it off the table BEFORE negotiations began!

    According to an email I received this morning from Dick Morris on behalf of the "League of American Voters" (a health care insurance industry front group), President Obama and senate Democrats are "working behind the scenes to change long-standing Senate rules so that they can pass their health plan with just 50 votes!". I wish!

    Actually, what the Democrats should do is get the blue dogs in line (by INSISTING that they vote against any filibustering) and then submit the bill for an UP OR DOWN vote. This is what the Republicans did. Why the hell can't the Democrats do the same??

    Most Rev. Gregori said... We do not need the governments involvement in this. The federal government has absolutely no Constitutional right or authority to be involved in health care... They are in violation of the Constitution.

    Baloney. Passage of health care legislation would "promote the general welfare". It's in the preamble to the Constitution.

    ReplyDelete
  187. My Sarcastic Opinion said... Listen FALSE Dude! Just as the young ladies said ... If Zippo want to "Change" things let him "Change" things for the better not come up with a plan that 3/4 of the American people are against.

    3/4 of the American people are against the health care bill?? Where does this statistic come from? The astroturf organization Freedom works? This stat, where ever you got it from, IMO is BS...

    Poll: Most Back Public Health Care Option: A clear majority of Americans -- 72 percent -- support a government-sponsored health care plan to compete with private insurers, a new CBS News/New York Times poll finds. Most also think the government would do a better job than private industry at keeping down costs and believe that the government should guarantee health care for all Americans. The new poll shows the idea of a government-sponsored plan, or "public option", to be fairly non-controversial...

    I agree with this poll. A government "takeover" of healthcare is what we need. Also, there currently is no bill. There are a number of bills, both in the House and the Senate, but the final version has yet to be worked out. So, even if we were to assume that your 3/4 stat were true (which it is not) -- how can 3/4 of Americans be against a bill that doesn't yet exist??

    ImAlwaysRight said... The whole world is screaming at what Obama is doing and these bloggers are supporting it.

    The "whole world" most certainly is NOT against the United States passing health care reform legislation. That is complete nonsense. All the other industrialized nations that already have some form of national health care think it's OK for them but not the United States? I'll assume that isn't what you meant. I'll assume that by the "whole world" you were talking about Americans. Your claim still isn't true. According to the CBS poll I linked to above -- 85 percent of Democrats think the government has a responsibility to provide health care to Americans (39 percent of Republicans AGREE). In case you haven't realized it, the DEMOCRATIC nominee won the presidency. The DEMOCRATS control the House and Senate. WHY souldn't Democrats pass legislation that Democrats want? IMO it is their OBLIGATION to do so! Elections have consequences.

    Pamela D. Hart said... No, I never said we couldn’t condemn our politicians. Their children are off limits, yes...

    I disagree. Sarah Palin has made it clear that her childern ARE are part of the discussion. When, for instance, she lied about the possibility of her baby with down syndrome being sentenced to die by an Obama "death panel". She USES her kids constantly for political gain (which I find sickening). People have the right to refute her lies.

    Frank The Thinking Man, said... The lying left and their hypocritical worthlessness to society and that includeds YOU Truth101!

    IMO it's the lying hypocritical Right that's worthlessness to society. I encourage Truth101 to keep telling it like it is. Seeing as I agree with a lot of what Truth101 has to say, I decided to take a look at his blog. I think he nailed it with his latest post.

    While over at Truth's blog I read a comment by Pamela D. where she declared that "if Obama and the Dems ram this bill through, they know they will have dire consequenses". I'm sorry, but that really is NOT true. I was watching MSNBC last night and according to what I heard the WH expects favorable public opinion of the health care bill to INCREASE after it's passage -- when all the bad things the right wing is predicting don't happen. Hopefully then the American people will remember who stood in the way of health care reform. Hopefully they'll also remember who stood with the American people -- and who was fearmongering on behalf of the health care industry.

    ReplyDelete
  188. In regards to the three long comments I just posted... I am NOT trying to "hijack" the conversation, as an earlier poster accused Truth101 of trying to do. I had a lot to say. There were 187 comments before mine and I didn't even respond to everyone I disagreed with.

    Pamela, I just added you to the "blogs I'm following"... and noticed that you have 107 followers! If you are willing to share how you accomplished this (as previously offered), you are welcome to email me the secret at the address located in my profile. Thanks.

    ReplyDelete
  189. I'm with you Pamela, if you don't trust the government why would you go to a government website to get the truth? It'd be like a JFK conspiracy theorist going back to consult the Warren Commission Report.

    ReplyDelete
  190. w-dervish said...

    In regards to the three long comments I just posted... I am NOT trying to "hijack" the conversation, as an earlier poster accused Truth101 of trying to do. I had a lot to say. There were 187 comments before mine and I didn't even respond to everyone I disagreed with.



    Well you can sleep with the Devil if you want too, I don't!!!. You get what you ask for and you GOT IT!
    But unfortunately we all got it with you.

    .

    ReplyDelete
  191. I simply answered the concerns of those on the other side of the debate. If they would rather hide underneath their snuggie of deluded thought, there is nothing I can do. Whirling Dervish answered everyone pretty well himself also. Welcome to the neighborhood WD.

    ReplyDelete
  192. This comment has been removed by the author.

    ReplyDelete
  193. This comment has been removed by the author.

    ReplyDelete
  194. ImAlwaysRight said...

    Well you can sleep with the Devil if you want too, I don't!!!. You get what you ask for and you GOT IT!
    But unfortunately we all got it with you.



    And I agree with you.
    Those who voted for this man deserves everything they are now getting.
    As for Truth101, well he's just another a big blowhard irreverent liberal nut-job that needs to be committed so that he doesn't hurt anyone.

    ReplyDelete
  195. Even I did not expect him to wreck this country in 200 days. His govt takeover of the car industry, the banking industry and his attempt at the takeover of the health industry is nothing more than a socialist/marxist grab at total power. He is a foreign born national who has neither the care for Americans or their country. His teachers were Marxists (not my words, HIS) and he is dooming this country to become a dictatorship likened to that of a third world country. This was a coup staged by the DNC and a power grab of those in the Senate....stand up people, it will get worse if you don't

    ReplyDelete
  196. ImAlwaysRight said... Well you can sleep with the Devil if you want too, I don't!!!. You get what you ask for and you GOT IT! But unfortunately we all got it with you.

    Beth Said... Those who voted for this man deserves everything they are now getting.


    My blog was started before President Obama began his run for the presidency. The title of the blog is in reference to the BUSH ADMINISTRATION.

    On YOUR blog I see a banner proudly proclaiming your support for waterboarding. Clearly YOU approve of the US government going over to the "dark side" (Cheney's words) in fighting the so-called "war on terror".

    This is EXACTLY what I meant by "Sleeping with The Devil".

    As for everyone who voted for Barack Obama getting exactly what they deserve -- sounds good to me. If only those who don't want these things could be excluded from receiving them.

    It boggles my mind that EVERYONE wouldn't want lower taxes and reasonably priced healthcare. But, if you don't want it then I suggest you forward to the IRS the money that is no longer being subtracted from your paycheck. And you should also refuse to sign up for lower cost government health insurance when it's available.

    If you can't PAY - either because you can't afford insurance or because your insurer denies your claim - you can crawl in a hole and die for all I care.

    Scratch that. I'd still take pity on you and want you to be helped. I am a bleeding heart liberal, after all. But, that IS what you are asking for. Unless you're a rich a-hole who has enough money to pay for any medical care you may need, without insurance that may be denied, and no matter how high your bill is.

    ReplyDelete
  197. Even though I voted for him, I really think that Obama is ruining this country.. From doubling (or is it tripling) our national debt, pushing our economy into a further decline (it started in the Clinton administration believe it or not. It got worse with Bush and it's past rock bottom with Obama...). Tell me...in this economy, why would you spend crucial dollars on a private flight to a Broadway show? Oh it was only twenty thousand or so, no big deal compared to the TRILLIONS of dollars he's pissing away to help 'improve' the economy. On top of his socialist or Marxist or Facist ideals (The media keeps changing it so it's hard to get the facts ^^). He's just bad news...

    Next thing you know he's going to launch nukes like fireworks and open up the borders so the scum from either side (Yes...Canada AND Mexico) of what was once a fine nation can further bring this country down. I have no problem with someone who wants to come over legally, but theirs more than enough immigrants here who mop up the floors of my local McDonalds.

    So yes. Obama is ruining this country fairly effectively. Screw war, if you want to ROYALLY screw a country over...give them Obama as their leader. In five months, he'll have them down to nothing.

    Edit: Canadian Diva, i never heard anyone call George Bush "Mr. Bush" or "President Bush". In fact, he was always just "Bush" to me. I'm not going to call anybody President who i didn't vote for, especially one who IS ruining this country.

    ReplyDelete

Note: Only a member of this blog may post a comment.

Related Posts Plugin for WordPress, Blogger...