Sunday, April 26, 2009

Hatred101

I’ve decided to address a problem that we, as a country, have had to deal with and a reader of mine brought up recently. You can read his comment here. I felt this topic needed a post all its own. I believe we’ve dealt with this situation a lot in the last 8 years and with the election of Barack Obama, it hasn’t dissipated like a lot of people HOPED it would. The era of being united has yet to be. At least I don’t see it, and my reader Octo doesn’t see it, either.

The Ubers are still out there. Who are the Ubers you ask? They are the crazies, the loons, the moon-bats, the wackos on the Left and Right. You’ve heard of them. They chain themselves to trees to save the tree. Or they kill the abortion doctor to save the baby. They don’t have rationale that WE normal people can comprehend. Their minds are virtually twisted.

For 8 years the Ubers on the Left have HATED Bush. They’ve wanted him DEAD, literally. Their hatred then spilled over to ANYONE who supported Bush or even remotely liked Bush or anyone associated with Bush. They HATE Bush today and will ALWAYS HATE Bush. Nothing short of a miracle will stop this blind hatred.

Now we have the Uber Right who HATE Obama. They want him DEAD, literally. Their hatred spills over to ANYONE who supports Obama or even remotely likes Obama. They are attacking people, like Octo, because Octo voted for Obama. They are blinded by their hatred and nothing short of a miracle will stop this hatred.

I’m respectful of EVRYONE and EVERY viewpoint; EXCEPT the Uber’s; because the Uber’s are illogical. Their views are irrational. However, you can’t argue with an Uber. The best course of action is to walk away because you won’t win an argument with an Uber. But how does one handle death threats from an Uber, as my reader has experienced?

I believe my reader did the right thing by calling the police. However, the authorities can only do so much. Unfortunately the Ubers are so twisted they don’t even realize when they’re breaking the law. They believe their cause is above the law. What then? Does one take the law into one’s own hands?

Are we supposed to suppress our voice because of the Ubers? I don’t think so. I believe we have to be true to ourselves. We have to value our principles and our values. We normal people on the Left and Right outnumber the Ubers by far. We have to make OUR stand and fight the good fight.

Our Eagle needs both wings to fly. So, don’t stifle yourself because of some Uber or something on some neglectful news station. Know your heart. Know IN your heart what you stand for. KNOW your values and principles and stand by them. I believe that as long as you’re true to yourself and you have respect, not just of yourself, but of others you will convey a commanding presence. Be powerful …be yourself. After that, what will be, will be.

64 comments:

  1. Would you consider any of the bloggers on your blog roll Ubers?

    The White House has said that President Obama has received more death threats than other Presidents? In only 23 months? I wonder how many death threats Presidents get?

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  2. I think that it's about time that Mr. Obama got a bit of what George Bush got for the past 8 years!!! Obama has gotten such a free ride throughout his life, and was elected without ANY kind of experience what so ever it's about time there was some opposition. Who the heck is he to be given such hands off treatment? He is NOT my Messiah

    It's too bad most of these people who want to put him on a pedestal wear blinders. And that just see what they want to see. I see something different. I see a man that has an agenda to bring this country into third worldism. Call me crazy or whatever you want to but the handwriting is on the wall. Some people just refuse to read it.

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  3. Pamela and Open Minded Republican, please accept my thanks for blogging on this subject. Apropos of this subject, here are some links that reveal the scope of the problem:

    About Kathy Sierra , a well-known technology consultant who was forced to cancel a public appearance due to online death threats.

    About the MySpace suicide case, how a mean-spirited prank pushed a vulnerable teenager over the edge?

    And just last week, this about an Oklahoma Man Arrested for Twittering Tea Party Death Threats.

    The above links show that kooks and trolls are by NO means benign.

    The Internet is an amazing tool for research and idea exchange, but there are always folks who abuse a good thing … who use it to harass, humiliate, stalk, and victimize other bloggers as if the Internet were a giant phantasmagoria for self-amusement by masochists and sadists … or a medium for narcissists and character disturbed folks who do not know how to manage their anger.

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  4. Commenters like Debonair Dude, and far worse molded me into what I am today OO and Octopus. If that means I am a "hateful troll" in your eyes, or just the left wing part of the problem, I am sad and sorry if I appear to you that way.

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  5. Well you hit the nail right on the old head.. Yes you are FAR worse.
    God bless the "Debonair Dude" if he gets on your case then I'm in his corner.. Surely not in yours!

    And you can put that piece of bat crap Lynne in the same category.

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  6. I've been away and I may have missed something ...But why is that Truth-101dude being SO hostile and insulting my good buddy DD2?
    But then again I guess he don't need any good reason to be hostile to anyone that is no of his political persuasion.

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  7. On a positive note Pamela, when they come here to jump my case your hit count has to make you proud.

    Missed you Wordy Guy.

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  8. I don't know what ticked this "Person" off, I never said anything to or about him, but I really couldn't care less...I don't get into Pissing Fights with his kind...
    Let him knock himself out and have a good time doing it.

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  9. I did campaign work for President Obama when he ran for US Senate. I did the same in 08 when he ran for president. I will work even harder in 2012 when he runs for his second term.





    That should bring em out Pamela. If it gets too crazy either tell me or delete this comment and I will stay away from your site.
    Thank you for allowing me to visit and post.

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  10. TRUTH 101 said...
    "I did campaign work for President Obama when he ran for US Senate. I did the same in 08 when he ran for president. I will work even harder in 2012 when he runs for his second term."You're gonna have too.

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  11. And I'm going to campaign for ANYONE that runs against him!

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  12. Pam, I am SO infuriated about this blog and I'm so fired up, that I Posted my own blog in reference to it. I think that what you have said about DD2 is pathetic and that you are looking in the wrong direction if you are looking for "HATRED" .

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  13. I must say that I'm in Throwing Stones and "The Debonair Dude's" corner here.

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  14. I must agree with the comment made by "Throwing Stones"

    If you really want to address the problem of Hatred101

    You need not to look any further then right here

    http://progressiveerupts.blogspot.com/

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  15. Well, I must say that now I know what it feels like to be attacked. It’s not a good feeling, especially when I have NO idea what I did wrong. I wrote a post about RADICALS. A totally generic post about Ubers, like Code Pink and Peta. I didn’t think I had to be explicit. I thought everyone would GET IT. Obviously I was wrong.

    I find now that I’m being ACCUSED of writing bad things about a blogger that I ADORE, Debonair Dude at Our World as We See it. He’s ALWAYS been kind and respectful to me and I’ve ALWAYS been the same to him. As I am to EVERYONE. That’s my MO. I don’t know why anyone would think I wrote this post about DD2; because this post was NOT about anyone in particular. I’m very saddened that my readers would think me so low as to accuse ANY of my readers of such a vile act. And I’m even more saddened that no one had the decency to ask me if it was about anyone specifically, except Truth, which I haven’t had the chance to get to his answer. I don’t think I want to answer him now.

    If any reader believes me to be an inconsiderate, cruel, heartless person, then I don’t want you on my blog anyway. Because if you’ve been following me, you know ME and you would then KNOW that I would NEVER be ruthless or mean-spirited.

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  16. Wordsmith: I don't think Truth or DD2 are hostile. I think they are "passionate" in their feelings and causes. There is a difference. Remember the written word can be misconstured. It's important not to take each word so literally and read between the lines, so to speak and NEVER ASSUME ANYTHING.

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  17. T101, this is the third comment thread in a week about Internet abuse, and the third time you trolled the conversation. I have repeated the same talking points about toxic Internet behavior that puts the safety of others at risk … along with linked examples of taunts and death threats. Yet, you seem to take great pride in trivializing a conversation … while adding nothing constructive or relevant. I have tried to avoid a confrontation, but you are annoying the hell out of me.

    Internet abuse is NOT about politics. It is about bullying. A serious reader questions the merits of an argument or viewpoint. A bully attacks the person. A bully uses words like “ignorant,” “scum,” and stupid” to attack the person, not the viewpoint. A bully is a narcissist who cannot distinguish one’s own viewpoint from one’s ego.

    And bullies are the worst of tyrants who assign themselves the role of thought-police and attack others for even the slightest deviation of opinion. One example that comes to mind is a group blog called Conservative Convictions, which turned into an orgy of intolerance so angry and toxic that one of its founders resigned. This is what she said:

    Jennifer: “I just don't feel like I fit in anymore. I consider myself a conservative because I truly want less government interference in our lives, and less spending. I thought conservatism was about individual responsibility! What I was truly surprised to find though was this blind hatred. This all or nothing mentality. I just don't have it in me to hate the man and wish his failure. To some, this does not make me conservative …

    What was her crime? An open and honest question. A free and independent thought. But not according to the bullies who considered her a RINO and a traitor to the cause. Shame on those of you who engage in this kind of Internet abuse.

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  18. BTW, Bob, I see you are same Bob who also harassed Jennifer.

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  19. In my comment, I wrote Truth asked me a question, I meant Time. I apologize for the confusion. Seems I'm on a roll.

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  20. Truth 101..."I did campaign work for President Obama when he ran for US Senate."

    You must have felt betrayed if you actually worked on his campaign as an Illinoisan, because he lied about his intentions to win that seat and to this day 4 years later due to his blind ambition, Illinois is now mis-represented by a two bit squatter named Tombstone Burris appointed by an indicted governor and supporter of Obama named Hot Rod Blagojevich as his replacement.

    Any Illinoisan should be enraged like I am that Obama used the state and the senate seat as a 100 day launching pad to the presidency. He hardly sat in the seat long enough to warm up his ass before embarking on this 2 year campaign intially financed by my tax dollars.

    Pamela,I kinda don't sse where you attacked him personally either as I can't find a link anywhere, but suffice it to say that DD2 is a friend of mine, and like him, am simply dishing out on my site to those lefties turned Obamorons the same thing they did to president Bush for 7 years, almost costing us a war and Iraqi's their freedoms which the left deemed undeserving by calling it Bush's illegal war and a waste of time and resources.

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  21. (O)CT(O)PUS said...

    "BTW, Bob, I see you are same Bob who also harassed Jennifer."

    What the HELL are you talking about?

    I never harassed Jennifer nor anyone else. It's MAGGOT'S like you that spread these vile rumors.

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  22. Pam, I read the post you wrote on my blog and I apologize.

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  23. Thank you Bob, now I need to see that Sandy, Throwing Stones and I'm Here to Say understand. This is so upsetting. Especially because I don't understand why it happened!

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  24. Pam, I'm sure that you were misled or mistaken or something like that. Because I also respect DD2 very much and I follow his blog daily.

    If anyone preaches hatred it's Truth101 and that Octopussy.
    And while we are on the subject that Gray Headed Monster was despicable.
    Thank you

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  25. Thank you American Girl. Because I would NEVER say anything but kind things about DD2. I don't know HOW this got all twisted.

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  26. Pamela, I know very well that this has been blown out of proportion. I always liked and respected you and your positions as much as you say you did mine.
    Please just forget these comments and why not close the comments to this post. It's only going to get more heated and you don't need or deserve that.
    No need to explain, I know you too well. Lets just move on..
    Or if you wish too, feel free to let anyone say whatever they like... I can take it. And I can also dish it out. Trust me, I won't crumble.
    The views expressed on my blog, are mine and mine alone. I won't back-track from any of them.

    Stay well :-)

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  27. I will do as you suggest DD2. I just wish I knew what the heck happened and why I was accused of attacking you, my friend. This is just maddness and it upset me so much. People need to realize the ramifications of their words BEFORE they start wacking away at the keyboard.

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  28. Pamela, I'm sure that DD2 does not blame you for anything. Keep up the good work on this blog and don't be intimidated.

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  29. Thank you, Chris, that means a lot.

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  30. I’ve had this comment section closed due to some confusion. However, I’ve had a few request to reopen it. I’m hoping EVERYONE now knows that this post is a GENERIC one and was NOT aimed at anyone in particular. If you want to comment, please feel free, but PLEASE follow my comment rules posted at the upper left hand corner of my blog and stay on topic. Thank you

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  31. Good, Pam. Lets see if everyone can behave themselves and post like Ladies and Gentlemen. Let's hope we can.

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  32. Pamela, just in case things get out of hand again, here is a modest suggestion.

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  33. Hmmm - wouldn't the word be Über? ;-)

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  34. I won’t let these hate mongers and phony posters with their agendas to run certain blogger off the web and to discredit our good people get away with anything.
    People like "LYNNE" and any other bloggers that use foul language and tha post without a blog to respond to should not be allowed to “hit and run”.. I’ve seen her nasty comments deleted by the blogger on several blogs and hat is EXACTLY what should be done. I know it takes work and it takes constant monitoring bu it’s the only way to put these people out of their misery. They really belong in an institution and should not be allowed any place near a computer.

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  35. This comment has been removed by the author.

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  36. Captain: "Hmmm - wouldn't the word be Über? ;-)"

    Captain, I think Pamela's intention was to keep out the um-louts.

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  37. Octo: that's too funny! It just goes to show how much power women can wield when they want. Although I don't think I can use THOSE tactics here! Unless I call all the male blogger's wives! However, I'm not a tattle-tale. I'll just rely on everyone being ladies and gentlemen like Debonair mentioned and I expect.

    Captain: Yes those women are a bit extreme right now. But they aren’t hurting anyone. A little reprieve from the bedroom won’t kill anyone. It will most definitely prove something though!

    Chris: You’re right. Lynne is NOT welcome here and if she shows up with her insults and slurs, I’m deleting her and anyone else like her. It is a lot of work; however, we need to keep our blogging community clean of trolls. If people want to comment respectfully, they are welcome.

    Octo: I’m assuming Captain was trying to be amusing…right, Captain? He certainly was NOT trying to cause any trouble…NOT on MY blog.

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  38. Pamela: "I’m assuming Captain was trying to be amusing…right, Captain? "

    Of course not. The Captain is one of the good guys ... a writer, German scholar, blogger and grammar checker extraordinaire.

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  39. It is amazing how a comment thread can turn into a feeding frenzy of wild accusations, miscommunications and rabid havoc all with the help of a troll or two.
    As soon as reason and cooler heads prevail, look how much more civil things have become.
    If we all make the effort to read slowly, understand fully and then answer thoughtfully, we might just be able to talk to each other like adults and fellow Americans. We can find our common ground and debate our uncommon ground.
    And I agree with My Blog that we have to be diligent and remove the troll comments. Engaging them is like having a food fight with 8 year olds.

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  40. Liberals are to thin skinned to debate
    They can not debate the issues like adults, and need to resort to calling people names. They need to resort to insulting, and downright nasty tactics. They don't seem to understand the word "civil"

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  41. I'm sorry Pamela. I was going to email you at your invitation but I don't have outlook express and was unable to find your email address.

    As much as I would like to adopt a more civil tone, I just don't see that it's possible and it wouldn't be fair to you to have to admonish and delete all day.

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  42. SarahG, this article by Pamela about hate and incivility evolved into a joint effort by both “conservative” and “liberal” bloggers. For the liberal side of this same discussion, please link here.


    If you read the comments here and at the other referenced site, you will find this:

    They know how to attack but they can't take their own medicine.

    Compare this comment with this:

    They can not debate the issues like adults, and need to resort to calling people names.

    So here we have two people from opposite sides of the political divide … saying the same things about each other. Each side paints the other in broad strokes -- ALL liberals do this -- ALL conservatives do that. Another word for making blanket statements about people is “stereotyping.”

    In truth, not all conservatives and liberals are uncivil to each other. For instance, Pamela and I are friends. We may disagree about issues and topics, but we never disrespect each other. A political discussion does not necessarily need to degenerate into personal attacks and insults.

    I understand you may have had unpleasant encounters at liberal websites. Did you leave an angry comment? If so, was the anger met with anger?

    My point is: There is a point where the cycle of rancor and bitterness needs to be broken … where each side learns how to argue the topic without pushing those personal buttons.

    I am posting a copy of this comment at my own site to share with my readers.

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  43. (O)CT(O)PUS I think that you and your group of Liberial Hippies have brought more than enough of your pain to this blog.
    And now they have started the same thing with Sarah G.
    Why not give it up already and move on to another topic. You surely have enough topics to write about ...you always find a cause to protest.. This one has had enough.

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  44. Yes, post it at your own site. And leave Pamela alone.

    You always say that you are sorry but continue to post about it here.
    GO Already.. There's a bus leaving right now..

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  45. Wow, Pam. You could never post again according to this comment section, and still be quite popular. Let's see how far this goes...

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  46. I put the responsibility on the personal actions directly on Shaw. She was way out of line.
    It's the responsibility of the blogs author to listen to both sides.
    The is no such thing as a "Liberal Blog" as she claims.
    The country STILL has free speech..(so far)

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  47. I think people need to realize it’s not the HUMAN we are disagreeing with, but the position that human takes. Some wonder how why I am so open to Liberals. Well, it’s because I have friends and family members who are Liberal. And if I want them in my life then I need to be respectful of them and their view points. While I may never change my position, I will at least listen to theirs. I was told by a Democrat, “I never had a Republican show me so much respect before.” I think that PROVES it can be done. My dad used to tell me ALL the time, “God gave you two ears and one mouth, so you listen twice as much as you speak.” Well, we have two hands and two eyes. But I think we need to use our EYES more than our hands while on the computer. I also think we should respond to other’s topics like we would want others to respond to ours. I don’t expect everyone to agree with me, but I do expect people to be considerate.

    Sarah: I realize you’ve had a nasty experience with some Liberals, I read those responses from that one blog. But maybe here you’ll see you can have a civil debate. Don’t judge the Liberals here by the ones you just dealt with.

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  48. "Our Eagle needs both wings to fly."

    Problem is, the left wing wants to determine the direction we go in, but let the right wing to all the work.

    That ain't gonna fly.

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  49. Right Klik: Lately, I think BOTH have dropped the ball. Our Eagle has tears in it's eyes and both wings need mended.

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  50. Pamela, I'm sorry to say that Right Klik is correct, there is NO reasoning with the left.
    They love to attack us and we can not just stand by and let them

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  51. Sarah, did you read my comment above Right Klik's. Please read that one. Here I have faith that there is some compromise.

    Also, I took everyone to task over at Shaw's. I'm sure I'll be chastised for that. But I am who I am...a mother hen.

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  52. You Liberal cry babies are too much!!!.
    I'm so sick of all of you liberals here that are picking on these posters for no reason other than the fact that they are republicans and wish to express their dissent .. Dissent Is Patriotic..remember that? Do you even realize your Hypocrisy?
    The shoe is on the other foot now. And you're acting just as I thought you would. Like little babies who can dish it out, but can't take it. Oh, that medicine sure tastes horrible when it's your own, doesn't it, little Democraps?
    And just who the hell do you think you are to even imply that your screwball baby butchering messiah is above critique, huh? He's not. He's just a man. A man who got elected by flaming socialists and people from Harlem who didn't even know where the hell he stood on any of the issues, but came out to vote for him because he was half black. and for no other reason.
    Yes, as usual, you liberals can dish it out, but they can't take it. You blamed Bush for anything and everything that happened for the past 8 years and now in only 3 months, look at you. Look at how you are acting towards these republican posters.. Posters that did nothing but expressed their opinions. I guess that's even taboo now that we have The Great Messiah in the oval office.








    If you're this upset over what these 2 Ladies said on their own blogs Trust me - this is just the beginning.
    Remember when you proudly stated how it was your patriotic duty and your rights as American citizens to voice dissent against our leaders if you felt they weren't doing the right thing? Remember?
    There's going to be a lot more anti-Obama stuff coming your way! And I'm going to love every minute of it.

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  53. It would be rude to not read your comments. I enjoy visiting conservative leaning blogs. And if a conservative blogger has information that refutes President Obama's positions, it is our duty as Americans to look at it and make our own judgements.

    As Pamela has told us, we can disagree without being disagreeable friends.

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  54. Truth has decided to change his debating tactics. I hope everyone will give him a chance.

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  55. I don't hate Liberals. But I admit it's difficult not to insult them for their idiocy.

    I have found that it's best to remember one truth about Liberals. It's easier to be tolerant of them when you understand this:

    :iberals always come down on the wrong side of any issue. Expect the worst from Liberals and any prediction you make about them will not be wrong.

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  56. You have no idea who I am because I've never entered your neck of the woods, but I followed a trail and it led here. I am a conservative and also a friend of Octo's. We've had debates and discussions and although we don't agree on the topics we respect each other. That is what I think is the whole problem in a nutshell. I can disagree with someone without calling them names. I can dislike who someone supports without disliking them. I have had conservatives who have put me down and liberals that have supported me. I just started a new blog where both sides are welcomed and positive debate is encouraged. I delete anything that includes name calling because that only takes away from what we are trying to accomplish. Although I've been absent for a while from the blogospere because I just found out my son had tourettes and my priorities are on him and my family. I hope to be back blogging soon because I feel that sights such as yours that have open minds are the future and will accomplish so much more than those that focus on putting others down. I applaud this post and what you are trying to do. Without the hatred I've found out that liberals and conservatives have common ground (not much, but some LOL) you just have to be open minded.

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  57. How about my original question?

    If so, which ones? If not would you approve of the hate speech I have seen on the blogs of your blog roll members? If not, why blog roll them?

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  58. How about my original question?

    If so, which ones? If not would you approve of the hate speech I have seen on the blogs of your blog roll members? If not, why blog roll them?


    Time: Are you trying to incite something here? I try to run a respectable blog. I have no control over any other blog. I have visited blogs on BOTH sides where they bash one another back and forth and I’ve even reprimanded them for it. However, I’m not the blog police.

    Why do I blogroll? Because that’s my policy. If someone blogrolls me; I blogroll them in return, Liberal and Conservative. It gives my readers variety. I’d like more Liberal blogs, but I haven’t found any others willing to blogroll mine. Know any?

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  59. Just trying to find out what you consider uber and what you do not consider uber.

    I believe my definition of uber is different than you definition of uber.

    As I told you weeks ago, some of the people on your blog roll attacked my blog with multiple negative comments. That's why I had to start using comment moderation. And yes, I have been attacked in the past by lefties, so I know it comes from both sides.

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  60. Time: I think my post describes what I consider an Uber.

    There is a fine line between hate speech and opinion and therein lies the problem. We must be very careful not to incite anger when we give our opinion. That’s why I’ve said numerous times - while on the internet we need to think twice before hitting the post button and while in person to listen twice as much as we speak.

    If what you mean by “attack” is name calling, then we have all been attacked. I think some who sit behind a computer screen get cyber-muscles. They use words like idiot, stupid, anti-American, terrorist, Obama-lover, Bush-hater and the list goes on and on. But is this hate speech or is it just a bunch of bored, immature people hiding behind a computer screen?

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  61. As I described before(maybe you didn't read my reply to you weeks ago) the attack consisted of flooding (over 60) my comment section with hate speech.
    Some were from bloggers on your blog roll, some were from the same bloggers that have left nasty comments on your blog, some were anonymous.
    When I visit a blog on your blogroll and see "Democrats are full of shit" in large and bold type, I consider that uber.
    I don't mind being called names, if the comment also speaks to the issue of the post, and I'm allowed to respond in kind.
    One of the reasons I won't go to Shaw's blog anymore is that I was called names and when I responded in kind I was chastised, but the original commenter using fowl language, was not.
    I won't put up with that kind of unfairness. I won't put up with sheer nasty comments. If someone wants to say my position sucks, fine state why, not just call me a name.
    And yes, I would consider what you described as hate speech. If you do not then I think you have been overexposed and to excepting to that kind of language.
    I happen to think that everyone is too easily accepting of this kind of speech because it has become acceptable in our communications by those who use it incorrectly.
    Pitbull, instead of disagreeing with my negative comments about Rush's speech, just accused me of having never listened to Rush.It was a lie, and how would he know if it was true or not? He didn't speak to the post or my description of Rush's words, he just spewed false accusations at and about me. Isn't that what we want to get away from? I do.
    I was upset when Pitbull said that I wrote for Huff blog, because I don't like Huff blog, and it was a total lie, and he refused to post my reply to say it was a lie. That's the kind of dealing that I label devious liars.

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